horse slaughter
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I know I dont really belong in this arguement but if I told the millions of people who breed too many dogs and cats that if they cant handle vet care and spay/neuter they shouldnt have a pet...I would have accomplished nothing. 9 million perfectly healthy dogs are put to sleep every year, not because no one can afford anything, but because there are just no one to take and care for them. Imagine though for a second what would happen to these dogs if killing them wasnt an option. We here in USA dont eat horses, but if we dont do something with them, someone else will, and without mercy of any kind. Lets hear some ideas, anyone?
"Poverty is owning a horse."
Edited to add that we cannot forget what the PMU industry has done to the numbers of horses out there, and where almost all of these horses ended up.
"Poverty is owning a horse."
Edited to add that we cannot forget what the PMU industry has done to the numbers of horses out there, and where almost all of these horses ended up.
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going4stamina
- Allowance Winner
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- Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:07 pm
Well, this will really hack off the "keep gov. out of my business crowd", but here goes:
The key to controlling the "unwanted" horse population is to control it at the outset by making those who intend to breed or buy understand the responsibility when they make an ownership or breeding decsion.
Proposed:
A new state registration fee of $275 for each horse. All horses grandfathered until or unless they--go to be bred or have a financial transaction (sale, gift, etc.).
Administered by individual states with assistance from vets and county extension offices.
New foals from here forward would ALL have to pay this fee. No horse could be registered in breed associations, participate in any equine event (including rodeo), or be eligible to be bred, shown, or sold without proof of registry. Registry fee would accrue interest in state coffers and be used for humane euthanasia and disposal. $75 fee reimbursement can be applied for if horse is gelded. Fines applied for any horse not registered and born/sold/bred or found in foal or with foal at side after cut off date.
Sorry--pony mills, yearly dispersals of untrained youngsters from the same "ranch", over-breeding, and buying and breeding horses you cannot afford to care for needs to end. Bottom line. The fee is insurance that your horse will have care care and disposal and YOU WILL BE RSEPONSIBLE FOR IT IN A HUMANE MANNER.
The key to controlling the "unwanted" horse population is to control it at the outset by making those who intend to breed or buy understand the responsibility when they make an ownership or breeding decsion.
Proposed:
A new state registration fee of $275 for each horse. All horses grandfathered until or unless they--go to be bred or have a financial transaction (sale, gift, etc.).
Administered by individual states with assistance from vets and county extension offices.
New foals from here forward would ALL have to pay this fee. No horse could be registered in breed associations, participate in any equine event (including rodeo), or be eligible to be bred, shown, or sold without proof of registry. Registry fee would accrue interest in state coffers and be used for humane euthanasia and disposal. $75 fee reimbursement can be applied for if horse is gelded. Fines applied for any horse not registered and born/sold/bred or found in foal or with foal at side after cut off date.
Sorry--pony mills, yearly dispersals of untrained youngsters from the same "ranch", over-breeding, and buying and breeding horses you cannot afford to care for needs to end. Bottom line. The fee is insurance that your horse will have care care and disposal and YOU WILL BE RSEPONSIBLE FOR IT IN A HUMANE MANNER.
There are people doing something about pet over population. There is a local group that thanks to the generosity of caring people sees to it that dogs and cats get spayed and neutered free and they will even have a volunteer pick the animal up and take it to the non profit spaying clinic and then bring it home again. Charity,education and caring have reduced the number being killed by millions per year in the US and that number can keep dropping. The same type of thing can reduce the number of unwanted horses. Education,breeding for soundness,charity and caring individuals,corporations and governments can all make a difference. In California and NY they have a purse takeout to help rescue Thoroughbred horses. Thousands less horses were bred last year because the slaughterhouses closed and hopefully that trend will continue. Educating people about their responsibilities and the likely cost of those responsibilities is a starting point. There are quite a few rich people involved with horses and the amount some people have paid for one horse could support quite a few horses for their entire lifetime($16M comes to mind). Livestock are exempt from sales tax in this state but a horse sales tax could be passed that would be used solely to help horses. KY charges sales tax on stud fees and they could use part of it to help horses in need. Owning a horse is not nearly as easy as getting a puppy or kitten since they cannot usually be kept by somebody with only a small place and local ordinances only allow horses in certain places. Somebody has to own or rent land or stall space and there are a lot less horse breeders large or small and except for wild horses they are not usually getting bred except when people want them to. Dogs and cats are so plentiful that if an unspayed female gets loose or runs loose she will most likely find a mate or two. Vets could sometimes donate their services to help and some have. The people most financially capable of helping the horses are usually donating to useless and sometimes cruel research or just buying more luxuries for themselves. If they can be persuaded to do the right thing then they will breed fewer and sounder horses and donate to help horses to find new homes. Some people have gotten very large amounts of money from horses and they should give back to horses and forcing them to help those they have made a living from with taxes or takeouts is somethinbg I could support. Part of every purse,auction sale, and stud fee could be used to benefit horses whether they are Thoroughbreds or not. It would apply to all auctions all breed racing purses and all stud fees on all horses no matter what breed + part of every registration fee could include an amount for horse rescue.
Crystal wrote:IMO this is all just sick.. When you have a pet, or a horse, or a bird for that matter you are with the animal UNTIL THE END.. No matter what!
If you can live with yourself knowing your animals last moments were in fear or pain or suffering at a processing plant, and not at home or in his paddock, surrounded by the folks that cared about them for so long that loved and bonded with them. Then you should not own a animal!
What about the millions of goldfish that are flushed down the toilet? Who's looking out for them? A couple year's back my daughter lost her cat so I went to the city AC unit on our side of town. I was shocked at the number of dogs and cats in line to be euthanized.... I'm talking in the thousands. And what a waste. These are aniimals could be harvested to Asian nations etc. but instead we treat them 'humanely' and 'put them to sleep' and then throw them on the scrapeheap to rot away or local landfill or incinerated. Humane indeed.
A horse can be processed for a multitude of purposes while euthanized in a 'humane manner' same way it is at home before being put in a hole in the ground or hauled off by the local rendering plant. But when the difference approahes a $1000 to do so this needs to change ASAP. $475 to have a horse euthanized and hauled off is ridiculous. Same horse could have been euthanized and processed for $500 cash. This nonsensical legislation won't stand as numerous ag states will soon enact horse processing plants as the economy contracts forcing action.
Ok, when it comes time for me to put my CAT to sleep because he is approaching 25 years old and it is becomming harder for him to jump on the bed with athritis (which I humanely spend $50 a month on meds for )..I will call you, So you can tell me the name of a family in Asia that would like to have Sylvester The House Cat for Thursday dinner.. I will pack him up in a carrier, but you can pay the airfair, and I will wish him well... sorry little guy, after 25 years this is how it has got to be.. I will sleep well tonight knowing your little paws are being picked clean by your new Asian family..
Last edited by Crystal on Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I doubt that $475. was spent on a horse that was fit enough to travel to a slaughterhouse or anyplace else. If the horse was sound enough to travel she could have donated it to a horse resuce so they could find it a home. If there was one close enough and she had a trailer it might only have cost her the price of gas and a little time. One could just dump old people off to be killed and fed to cannibals. There are still people who eat people. They could drop off disabled people to be killed also or anybody that was useless or unwanted.
ArchDandy wrote:aardvark wrote:the biggest problem with either side of this argument is that you need responsible people; there is a significant shortage of those.
Amen.
Amen twice. I raise an occasional litter of blue danes. Two litters to be exact. Why only 2, because while I see people loving the fact that they can rake in $1500+ a puppy, I need to be ready to take these dogs back at anytime in their life if the occasion arises.
All animals, horses,dogs,cats, ferrets, what have you, need RESPONSIBLE people behind them. I have a nice TB filly who will never see a breeding shed unless she shows running or jumping ability. And I don't mean running around the pasture and jumping a log or two.
trying to come up with something brillant..... this may take a while. 
horsenuts wrote:soundfast wrote:I am in favor of justice and against cruelty. In India where cows work pulling plows and carts it is illegal to kill them for meat. They believe that the cows deserve better after working for them. Is gratitude a concept beyond the comprehension and moral compass of some horse owners? It certainly seems to be. Those who do not care about others whether they be horses or cows or any other creature including their fellow man should be forbidden to own them or produce human offspring. The same type of people do not care how many people are being maimed and killed or how much suffering they endure. I personally am against man's inhumanity to man and man's inhumanity to other creatures. People owe a debt to their horses in most cases. They did not get here by themselves but were bred by people and trained by people to serve people and people should show their gratitude for their help. Most people think they deserve a pension and a retirement income after making money for others why shouldnt a horse get the same. NY city taxpayers fund the retirement of their police horses who are not making people huge sums of money like some other horses. People owe horses who make money for them,who work for them, just like any employee. I happen to have 2 pensioned cows that are 16 years old and a pensioned 33 year old mare who never made me one cent but my daughter and I did ride her a few times. I saved a horse from slaughter many years ago and never regreted it and never made any money from him either. The inhumane slaughter of cattle turned me into a vegetarian. The hog barn had already made me boycott pork which came after boycotting veal. I have raised chickens,ducks,and guineas and never killed any to eat. I did eat eggs from them. I saved 20 battery cage hens from slaughter one year. They were great layers once they recovered from their previous life. It matters how they die just like it matters how they live. Imagine you are the animal on the way to slaughter. One mare was hit 12 times in the HBO video according to what I read. Imagine your suffering with repeated blows and watching others die before you and the suffering they endure. Imagine your last thoughts about the people that sent you there and the people that beat you struck you repeatedly made you go hungry and thirsty and then after you watch your dead body strung up and dismembered how you will feel as your soul watches others suffer and die. Your soul lives on and leaves that place but the memories of that hell linger on. Your last memories of this world would have been so different if someone had cared enough to let you live out your life and then painlessly and with dignity you left this life knowing that you were loved and not just meat on the hoof to some uncaring selfish people.
I appreciate your position even if I disagree with it. And therein lies the problem. Those who oppose slaughter see it only their way all too often. I'm pro-choice on the matter just as I am with abortion. No, I don't recommend abortion but I believe a woman has a right to choose how her pregnancy will be handled, Same way with sending a horse to the killers. It's not for me but I have worked with livestock all my life and realize the realities of when an animal has come to the end of the line regarding its usefulness or purpose. Most folks look for another life for said animals but if no takers they need to move on and if that means $400 cash selling to the glue factory that is their perogative. Like abortion it's not for everybody but being as it is their animal they are entitled to sell if so desired.
And the facts are very few animals pan out to be the horse they were hoped for when bred. That is just a harsh fact of the breeding business. If the owner of such an animal cannot get a decent price then his only option for a sale is often to the killers. And unless we are going back to the days of Kings and serfs anyone should be allowed to own horses here in America even the lowly serf like citizens. And afterall wasn't it some of the Kings of the sport who felt guilty after being called on the carpet for letting one time Champion horses like Ferdinand and Exceller end up in a sausage grinder? So perhaps it is the Kings who shouldn't own horses and not those "who don't have the resources" or the like.
Look where this dubious legislation has lead: One of the long time posters on this forum stated how she had to pay $475 to have a horse put down and disposed of. Had the glue factories still been in operation she could have sold said animal and not suffered such a financial setback due to the wants of those opposed.
The anti-slaughter folks can buy all the rescue type horses they want from the slaughter houses and that is as it should be and will be once a few legislators realize the predicament many of their constituents now find themselves in with current legislation.
Ah, pro-choice, that explains much, is that your form of birth control? To me pro choice means murder. sorry because you buy a pet doesn't mean you go smash it with a hammer because "it's your property you can do what you want with it".
horsenuts wrote:hdembski wrote:http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/06/10/horses-slaughter.html
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/s ... ml?ref=rss
the first article talks about the original clip i saw, the second article talks about the response in canada.
I do not fully understand the business side of things and do understand a horse has to be put down. But when the article talks about horses transported with shoes on or a guy getting frustrated that he can't stun the horse so he hits it with a stick, i have a huge problem with that. Horsenuts you can cite your business side of it and i can quote John Paul II who stated animals have souls. Any animal so beautiful deserves a dignified death. Not things i see in some slaughter house in Canada or Mexico done by soul-less people. If someone is selling horses for meat "because they are the persons property and it's a business" that's sick. Go work at Walmart or something.
You had no problem "humanely euthanizing" your mare so if we can employ similar vets as you used at the kill plants lets open them tomorrow. I knew their was common ground to be found.
Only thing i humanely put down was my last dog. Only after spending over 2k trying to find out what was wrong. Big difference between that and a horse that doesn't need to be put down who is being beat with a stick because some moron can't use a stun gun the right way or is frustrated or some european likes horse meat. If i'm married to you and support you financially in a sense do i own you too? Can i put you down if i find a younger girl to be with? Where is the line drawn?
"What about the millions of goldfish that are flushed down the toilet? Who's looking out for them? "
most are flushed when they die, not when they are still living.
"A couple year's back my daughter lost her cat so I went to the city AC unit on our side of town. I was shocked at the number of dogs and cats in line to be euthanized.... I'm talking in the thousands. And what a waste. These are aniimals could be harvested to Asian nations etc. but instead we treat them 'humanely' and 'put them to sleep' and then throw them on the scrapeheap to rot away or local landfill or incinerated. Humane indeed."
if they are given a shot and incinerated, that's humane, better than being in a oversized pen, slipping, hoping some guy can hit me in the head right, or being knifed. Harvested in Asia? What kind of food you eating?
"$475 to have a horse euthanized and hauled off is ridiculous. "
yes, and dogs and cats are over vacinated to support vet hospitals. It's how they make their money, unless you get educated and call them on it, if initial vacine shots are given right, a dog doesn't need most vacinations for the rest of their life.
most are flushed when they die, not when they are still living.
"A couple year's back my daughter lost her cat so I went to the city AC unit on our side of town. I was shocked at the number of dogs and cats in line to be euthanized.... I'm talking in the thousands. And what a waste. These are aniimals could be harvested to Asian nations etc. but instead we treat them 'humanely' and 'put them to sleep' and then throw them on the scrapeheap to rot away or local landfill or incinerated. Humane indeed."
if they are given a shot and incinerated, that's humane, better than being in a oversized pen, slipping, hoping some guy can hit me in the head right, or being knifed. Harvested in Asia? What kind of food you eating?
"$475 to have a horse euthanized and hauled off is ridiculous. "
yes, and dogs and cats are over vacinated to support vet hospitals. It's how they make their money, unless you get educated and call them on it, if initial vacine shots are given right, a dog doesn't need most vacinations for the rest of their life.
I'm with you Crystal, life itself is terminal and we are all going to die, and when we do, I believe we will all get what we deserve, and I do believe in Karma, what goes around comes around. so when God's creature's come your way, and you don't do right by them, good greif, I would not want to be you on YOUR Judgement day.