Michael Gill and fluphenazine

[JimP]

Hi Guys,

'fluphenazine, an antipsychotic medication used to treat schizophrenia and psychotic symptoms in humans, as a Class 2 substance"

Mr. Gill is suing the New York racing commission over two positive tests for this drug. Why in the #$@% would you give this to a horse? Who came up with this wonderful idea????

I am not here to trash Mr. Gill but really wonder what kind of playing field he is really operating on?

Oh! Happy New Year!!!

JimP

[henthorn]

Maybe one of the psychotic patients shared his meds with the horses!?

[ageecee]

Hes on operating on a LARGE playing field. he has lots of money and that will get you most places in this game.

[valerie]

I know of several of the barrel racing trainers that give this to their almost blown up futurity horses. It sometimes backfires on them and makes them so hot that they are not worth riding. Supposed to make them focus on the job at hand. I think it should be on the not allowed list of equine medications and don't know why anyone thinks they need to use it. JMO of course.

[Marli]

I read the article as well on TTimes and couldn't believe a drug such as this would be given to a horse??? I'll second the comment - who came up with this brainstorm?

Descriptive info-
http://www.tiscali.co.uk/lifestyle/heal ... 03213.html

I have never heard of anyone, in any discipline, administering this type of drug?

[wilf]

Mr Gill and his trainers have left a trail of strange behaviour and dead horses wherever they have operated.As Bob Dylan once sang 'Y ou dont need a weather man to know which way the wind blows." They need a dose of that stuff themselves , wouldnt hurt.

[JimP]

Hi Guys,

Wilf I have to agree.........it is like the old blister medicines..........if it was so damn good do it to yourself.

[henthorn]

I prefer to allow the track stewards to deal with any guilt associated with Mr. Gill or anyone else. I certainly don't know all the facts.

Judging without knowing all the facts seems to be a popular sport in America these days--on the forum, television, politics, and just about everywhere we look. I hope not to be on the receiving end some day.

[wilf]

You dont need the stewards to show you a dead horse. Its already a fact Henthorn, read the charts its all the proof you need, and I know the law of averages may say that if you run 1000 runners a year then something has to give but I have found repeatedly that everywhere I have raced only 5% of the trainers account for 95% of the breakdowns.I was never happy with that as one who made a living by asking horses to run faster than other horses.The simple FACTS are that many people race horses for business purposes and the claiming game leaves the animal open to all sorts of abuses.The medication rules of North American racing encourage horsemen to push the animal farther than prudent judgement would allow. I know its a fine line but there are those out there that are always looking for the edge to win a race or to lose a horse that has nothing left in the tank, they give the sport a bad name. The edge usually comes in the form of the latest drug that has not yet been identified by the testing labs.As a trainer of claimers sometimes your heart sinks when you lose a horse to one of the outfits whose horses usually end up on the scrapheap.I never became a trainer because I disliked horses.

[Pie™]

ok, I have to admit, I've used prolixin on one of my horses. It was after posting here about it, looking for advice when it was recommended to me at the training farm where my 2YO was and I'd never heard of it. I got, as I recall, more positive responses to its use in skittish, young horses, as an aide to help them stay focused on the task at hand.

I don't recall getting any negative press at the time about its use, which, combined with talking to two vets and other trainers, I was told that it is frequently used, although not FDA approved for use in horses. And it did work. It took my skittish 2YO filly to a point where she could be broke, mounted and started while taking away the "frights" from her.

We did use it in combination with more time on the farm, more ground work than rider up work, and letting her continue to mature rather than sending her right to the track as a 2YO. Its long acting - she actually only had one shot that lasted about 6 weeks. She was a little "cocky" but went from being so nervous about everything to that, so it was a definite improvement. When she came off it, we put her on a natural calming supplement, which in my opinion, worked just as well as the prolixin without the cockiness, but that could also have been the extra 5 months she spent at home, with lots more in hand work, ground work, maturing and turnout. So, it could've just been she matured more over the rest of the summer.

I will say I am surprised at this response, since, again, as I recall, so many of the responses to the use of prolixin in horses, was, at that time I posted (I think July??), positive to its uses.
Of course, racing under the influence is a completely different matter, but as a training aide, I was under the impression that it was not such a far fetched mechanism to take a nervous horse to the point where they could get some positive training under their belt.

[BJ]

The biggest problem with using these drugs, IMO, is NOT the advantage it gives (perceived or imagined), but the SIDE AFFECTS they all have on horse and human. Unfortunately, in this business, it is usually the folks upset about someone gaining an advantage, rather than what it does to the animal that effect change in the testing and "allowed medications" procedures. THAT is why this business has its tainted name. It's always about money...rarely about honor or compassion.

[valerie]

You dont need the stewards to show you a dead horse. Its already a fact Henthorn, read the charts its all the proof you need, and I know the law of averages may say that if you run 1000 runners a year then something has to give but I have found repeatedly that everywhere I have raced only 5% of the trainers account for 95% of the breakdowns.I was never happy with that as one who made a living by asking horses to run faster than other horses.The simple FACTS are that many people race horses for business purposes and the claiming game leaves the animal open to all sorts of abuses.The medication rules of North American racing encourage horsemen to push the animal farther than prudent judgement would allow. I know its a fine line but there are those out there that are always looking for the edge to win a race or to lose a horse that has nothing left in the tank, they give the sport a bad name. The edge usually comes in the form of the latest drug that has not yet been identified by the testing labs.As a trainer of claimers sometimes your heart sinks when you lose a horse to one of the outfits whose horses usually end up on the scrapheap.I never became a trainer because I disliked horses.

My hats off to you, I agree wholeheartedly with your point of view. I think that racing would do better with a return to actual training and less dependance on drugs.

[Intrinsic Worth]

How about the rampant use of Equipose and Viagra in racehorses? No one seems to mention that. It runs rampant here in Michigan with the trainers. Not to mention the drug runs they make to Canada.

[BJ]

How about the rampant use of Equipose and Viagra in racehorses? No one seems to mention that. It runs rampant here in Michigan with the trainers. Not to mention the drug runs they make to Canada.

o.k....I'll bite...what on earth do they use Viagra for in racehorses, besides the obvious?

[Intrinsic Worth]

It really hypes them up and works VERY well. The coating will test, so they soak the pills in water until the coating disappears. Herbal forms of Viagra work to a lesser degree.