Jason Shandlers chat blogs (Curlin vs Big Brown in BC Turf) & (What did we learn from Big Brown's Haskell) seems to be highly censored against Big Brown. The Blood Horse rightly determines what is acceptable on their blogs. For some reason my last Blog was excluded after multiple entries being printed, so I have to wonder if the Blood Horse has some special association with the Curlin camp. If I can be excluded are there more like me. They have allowed stronger language against Big Brown and yet my third instalment they found to be too threatening, tell me what is so threatening with the Aug 5/08 entry.
This first post allowed for (Aug. 4/08) - "Remember this prediction......This is why I'm going to stick my neck out and say that Big Brown will win the Breeders Cup Classic and the Curlin connection understanding the true talents of Big Brown will skip the race and not enter in the Classic. So racing fans be prepared for some elaborate excuse from the "Curlin Camp" like ankle twist, fever etc. I think we need to keep our eyes on this developing story and understand that Curlin will end his career before the Classic and we should see it for what it will be...."DUCKING BIG BROWM"!
NOT POSTED (Aug. 5/08) - Well not even 24 hrs has passed since I started the Ducking post comment on Curlin and what do I find written on the Blood Horse front web page today;
"“I’d like to go (to the Classic),” Jackson said. “I’m a native Californian. But it’s on an untested surface. It causes great concern. Why run a horse like Curlin that is on a surface that's undefined? We’ve won the Classic – been there, done that. (If we did go), I would love to have a prep race on the exact surface, but it doesn’t appear we will be able to. We would probably only be able to exercise on it a few times. The Breeders’ Cup has two races to consider. We’re also invited to Japan and Hong Kong. We’re keeping all our options open.”
Need I say more..with predictions like this I should charter the next flight out of Ottawa to Vegas!
Doesn't sound too offensive to me........I know you guys will now call me a conspiracy nut!
Blood Horse Blogs heavily skewed against Big Brown
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foothillsequine
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Sorry, I'm not with you on this one. The odds were against Curlin going to the Classic months ago. That's when he was looking at the Arc and Jackson leaned against the synthetic surface. Oh right, and he already won the Classic. The only change in the plan is to lean toward the BCC rather than against it and that happened (if it's happened at all) strictly based on Curlin's grass race, nothing to do with Big Brown. Frankly post-Preakness BB's just not been as impressive, particularly in the Haskell since he seemed to be coming around in training and the field wasn't the strongest. Between the connections of Curlin and Big Brown, the award for 'least obnoxious' goes to Curlin's, sorry (it's a dubious honor as both have issues). I think Jackson's spoiling for a fight and I don't think for one minute he's obligated to go to the Classic for it. BB's the one ducking. I'm not sure the post you had excluded was offensive in terms of name-calling, but I think it was wrong in a way that could be construed as inflammatory to Curlin fans (and, well, a lot of people frankly because I'm not sure I really love either and I didn't like the post). If Bloodhorse doesn't feel like posting it, sorry, it's a privately owned thing. I've been in Yahoo!Groups that had harsher posting restrictions. Offensiveness is in the eye of the moderator.
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana"
I agree with heidilady. I don't know if offensive is exactly the word I'd use but you seem to be congratulating yourself for predicting the sky will be blue if it isn't cloudy. Curlin's connections have been saying he was going to skip the SA Classic almost since he won at Monmouth, long before BB became a significant factor.
Who's ducking who?
If Curlin were to race against Big Brown and win I would tip my hat to Curlin and admit I was wrong but until they meet I still think Big Brown would crush Curlin.
However what really irks me is the bad press Big Brown is now getting over his fall campaign and that somehow the connections are dodging Curlin and that it's incumbent upon Big Brown to meet the more seasoned and fresher horse. Last time I check 3 year olds depending on their situation are slowly brought back after the long triple crown races, many times wonderful 3 year olds are put on the shelf for the season and never make it to the Classic as 3 year olds - one example Awesome Again. With Big Brown we have a horse with feet issues and never having run as a 2 year old and yet he seems to be getting the bad press for not taking on Curlin before the Classic. Instead I see a Horse of the Year skipping the biggest American dirt race because the surface is not to his liking - I don't care when these comments were made to me it's a choke job. Why more people are not more peeved at the Curlin connection for skipping the American Classic to possibly race in Japan is beyond me.
Oh and if anybody out there thinks that Curlin will instead attempt to make history by winning the 1 1/2 Turf you can forget about it - there is no way that Curlin can beat the best turf horses in the world going a 1 1/2.
This is why my prediction remains that Curlin realizing his deficiencies and the competition he is up against will skip the Breeders Cup all together. I agree "he has too much too loose and nothing to gain" !
However what really irks me is the bad press Big Brown is now getting over his fall campaign and that somehow the connections are dodging Curlin and that it's incumbent upon Big Brown to meet the more seasoned and fresher horse. Last time I check 3 year olds depending on their situation are slowly brought back after the long triple crown races, many times wonderful 3 year olds are put on the shelf for the season and never make it to the Classic as 3 year olds - one example Awesome Again. With Big Brown we have a horse with feet issues and never having run as a 2 year old and yet he seems to be getting the bad press for not taking on Curlin before the Classic. Instead I see a Horse of the Year skipping the biggest American dirt race because the surface is not to his liking - I don't care when these comments were made to me it's a choke job. Why more people are not more peeved at the Curlin connection for skipping the American Classic to possibly race in Japan is beyond me.
Oh and if anybody out there thinks that Curlin will instead attempt to make history by winning the 1 1/2 Turf you can forget about it - there is no way that Curlin can beat the best turf horses in the world going a 1 1/2.
This is why my prediction remains that Curlin realizing his deficiencies and the competition he is up against will skip the Breeders Cup all together. I agree "he has too much too loose and nothing to gain" !
To Heidilady - "Real Champions"
Let's be thankful for real Champions like Cigar and Tiznow who did not think they were bigger than the game and returned their following year in the Classic to reveal true guts and heart!
Glory is not always about winning but showing up for the fight as Cigar did that memorable fall day at woodbine.
Glory is not always about winning but showing up for the fight as Cigar did that memorable fall day at woodbine.
Re: Who's ducking who?
Pat wrote:Instead I see a Horse of the Year skipping the biggest American dirt race because the surface is not to his liking
In your rush to justify your opinion you're overlooking the obvious--Santa Anita does not have a dirt surface. Hence the problem.
No, what I'm saying is that he will not race on any surface hence he will skip the Breeders Cup instead of attempting to prove his horse is a real champion that can take on any challenge.
The rest is just window dressing by Jackson because like you said LB there is no dirt....so he should stop pretending that Curlin is a world class turf horse.
Jackson is not a dumb man and knows his horse is at his best on dirt at 1 1/4 (for me Big Brown wins anyway). But he's going to pretend to the racing public that he has options come Breeders Cup day when I'm convinced he will be a no show.
The rest is just window dressing by Jackson because like you said LB there is no dirt....so he should stop pretending that Curlin is a world class turf horse.
Jackson is not a dumb man and knows his horse is at his best on dirt at 1 1/4 (for me Big Brown wins anyway). But he's going to pretend to the racing public that he has options come Breeders Cup day when I'm convinced he will be a no show.
I don't particularly care for all this prodding and lobbying and shaming horse owners to take their charges to this race or that race. In Curlin's case, he has accomplished just about all that there is left to do, given his dirt limitations. If he runs and wins in the Woodward or some similar appropriate venue, and is retired afterwards, I wouldn't complain. (Or even if he lost.) In fact, it would make the most sense, both for the horse and his connections. I don't see the point in continuing beyond, given the mess the BC is in.
The same goes for the Big Brown camp. I don't care what they decide regarding their next race or the BC. This fall is a washout as far as I'm concerned. The BC and the dogooders who foisted artificial surfaces on the sport are to blame.
The same goes for the Big Brown camp. I don't care what they decide regarding their next race or the BC. This fall is a washout as far as I'm concerned. The BC and the dogooders who foisted artificial surfaces on the sport are to blame.
steward wrote:I don't particularly care for all this prodding and lobbying and shaming horse owners to take their charges to this race or that race. In Curlin's case, he has accomplished just about all that there is left to do, given his dirt limitations. If he runs and wins in the Woodward or some similar appropriate venue, and is retired afterwards, I wouldn't complain. (Or even if he lost.) In fact, it would make the most sense, both for the horse and his connections. I don't see the point in continuing beyond, given the mess the BC is in.
The same goes for the Big Brown camp. I don't care what they decide regarding their next race or the BC. This fall is a washout as far as I'm concerned. The BC and the dogooders who foisted artificial surfaces on the sport are to blame.
It's not about prodding owners in this instance. If we call them on how they're misrepresenting both their sense of sportsmanship and drive to compete rather than duck the best opponents, it's saying 'hey quit BSing us.' I think they should shut their gobs rather than tell us things they're going to backtrack on. They're doing all sorts of things and making claims about how they're running their operation, trying to look like the good guys, when it's all an illusion--they talk about the prestige of the Travers and how great it would be to win, then turn around and badmouth it not to mention other horses and trainers before going for the Haskell which came up easier than the Travers is. Don't tell us they're gonna go anywhere if you don't want people getting excited about this matchup or that one. Say 'we know but we'd rather not feel pressured to stick to what we said a month ago so we'll stay quiet at this time.' He's ducking Curlin and being careful with those feet, plain and simple. Bailey just said on the Arlington Million coverage that Kent was hitting BB like a rented mule down the stretch. Turns out he went to the whip 15 times to muster that response they said. I think it's crap NY is gonna basically card some race in Sept on the grass at the distance and timing BB wants for the BCC transition rather than make him act like a champ and face Curlin and Commentator on a surface that all know they run well on. If he wants grass, go find one that's a graded stake other top horses are pointing toward and face someone decent.
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana"
Heidilady wrote:steward wrote:I don't particularly care for all this prodding and lobbying and shaming horse owners to take their charges to this race or that race. In Curlin's case, he has accomplished just about all that there is left to do, given his dirt limitations. If he runs and wins in the Woodward or some similar appropriate venue, and is retired afterwards, I wouldn't complain. (Or even if he lost.) In fact, it would make the most sense, both for the horse and his connections. I don't see the point in continuing beyond, given the mess the BC is in.
The same goes for the Big Brown camp. I don't care what they decide regarding their next race or the BC. This fall is a washout as far as I'm concerned. The BC and the dogooders who foisted artificial surfaces on the sport are to blame.
It's not about prodding owners in this instance. If we call them on how they're misrepresenting both their sense of sportsmanship and drive to compete rather than duck the best opponents, it's saying 'hey quit BSing us.' I think they should shut their gobs rather than tell us things they're going to backtrack on. They're doing all sorts of things and making claims about how they're running their operation, trying to look like the good guys, when it's all an illusion--they talk about the prestige of the Travers and how great it would be to win, then turn around and badmouth it not to mention other horses and trainers before going for the Haskell which came up easier than the Travers is. Don't tell us they're gonna go anywhere if you don't want people getting excited about this matchup or that one. Say 'we know but we'd rather not feel pressured to stick to what we said a month ago so we'll stay quiet at this time.' He's ducking Curlin and being careful with those feet, plain and simple. Bailey just said on the Arlington Million coverage that Kent was hitting BB like a rented mule down the stretch. Turns out he went to the whip 15 times to muster that response they said. I think it's crap NY is gonna basically card some race in Sept on the grass at the distance and timing BB wants for the BCC transition rather than make him act like a champ and face Curlin and Commentator on a surface that all know they run well on. If he wants grass, go find one that's a graded stake other top horses are pointing toward and face someone decent.
You can label it anything you want - "calling out", "crap", whatever - but its a completely pointless exercise. Not to mention bs all its own. Talk is cheap. Let me suggest something different. Why don't you and all these other righteous internet chatters group together, fork over about $8 mill, and set up a match race? Rather than blowing smoke?
Both of these owner groups are dealing with their horse's physical limitations and talents. As it is, the BCC at the end of the season isn't fitting for either of them. So they're headed in different directions. If each is gunning for a large purse at an end-of-year (or even end-of-career for each) finale, why would either of them want to face each other in a tune-up race?
Putting the BCC on joke surface enabled this, if not caused it completely. Thank the dogooders.