Spendthrift breeding programs

wgc517 · Postby **wgc517** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:37 am

Looking for some thoughts on Spendthrift's breeding programs. Are they a fail deal or is it better to pay the fee. Has anyone done it? Are there any hidden concerns/issues?

thanks

Mood Swings · Postby **Mood Swings** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:34 am

Are you referring to the "Share the Upside" or "Breed Secure"?

I am not a participant in "Breed Secure" but I don't see how you can go wrong with this. This is more then fair in my opinion and there is essentially no risk to you as the mare owner.

I am taking advantage of their "Share the Upside". I think this is more beneficial to someone that has more then one mare, ideally several mares. You only pay the stud fee after you have a live foal (no different then most contracts), the only obvious difference is that you must breed a mare back the following year. After producing two live foals - voila! You have now secured a lifetime breeding right

This can go both ways, if the stallion tanks, no biggie, hopefully after getting two, three or even four foals, you have already earned back the money spent on the program and then some. If the stallion takes off....well you will be sitting pretty as long as he is breeding

bdw0617 · Postby **bdw0617** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:44 pm

Mood Swings wrote:Are you referring to the "Share the Upside" or "Breed Secure"?

I am not a participant in "Breed Secure" but I don't see how you can go wrong with this. This is more then fair in my opinion and there is essentially no risk to you as the mare owner.

I am taking advantage of their "Share the Upside". I think this is more beneficial to someone that has more then one mare, ideally several mares. You only pay the stud fee after you have a live foal (no different then most contracts), the only obvious difference is that you must breed a mare back the following year. After producing two live foals - voila! You have now secured a lifetime breeding right This can go both ways, if the stallion tanks, no biggie, hopefully after getting two, three or even four foals, you have already earned back the money spent on the program and then some. If the stallion takes off....well you will be sitting pretty as long as he is breeding

how can they possibly make money on this.

what if you go to wilburn and you get 2 breeding to him and now you have a breeding for life secured and he takes off and now they want to jump the fee or double it or whatever but everyone has breeding shares.

the only thing i could see them doing at that point is over breeding him and at that point you are SOL if you are breeding to sale because they are going to flood the market to try to make money, a la alydar with calumet

i mean it sounds GREAT. like almost too good to be true. i'd be all over that. they have a few sires that you look at and say "thse are okay sires" like paddy o prado and wilburn, but that would do it right there.

Barcaldine · Postby **Barcaldine** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:48 pm

I signed on for two lifetime seasons to WILBURN and am thrilled at the prospects. At $6500 LF I would have bred to him anyway so this opportunity really works well for me. He's a gorgeous horse but toes out in both fronts so I plan on breeding two very correct mares, a Silver Deputy and a Stormy Atlantic.

I also signed up for AMERICAN LION at Darby Dan, which emulates the Spendthrift program.

It seems a very smart idea for these stallion owners to expose their stallions to the better books of mares these horses will attract. I know that I am more vested in the horse's future because of my involvement so am sending higher quality mares than I would have otherwise sent to a $6500 stallion.

LB · Postby LB » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:45 pm

bdw0617 wrote:how can they possibly make money on this.

what if you go to wilburn and you get 2 breeding to him and now you have a breeding for life secured and he takes off and now they want to jump the fee or double it or whatever but everyone has breeding shares.

the only thing i could see them doing at that point is over breeding him and at that point you are SOL if you are breeding to sale because they are going to flood the market to try to make money, a la alydar with calumet

i mean it sounds GREAT. like almost too good to be true. i'd be all over that. they have a few sires that you look at and say "thse are okay sires" like paddy o prado and wilburn, but that would do it right there.

You have to be accepted into the program, and Spendthrift offered a limited number of spots for each stallion. So "everyone" won't have breeding shares.

Count me as another who thinks that it's a great idea.

karenkarenn · Postby **karenkarenn** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:16 pm

I was offered last year to bred to Line of David for the Lifetime Breeding rights but what I am seeing is the decline in stud fees for freshman and sophmore sires. Why should I have to pay 6500 twice for a sire that isn't proven ---- yet.....

wgc517 · Postby **wgc517** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:49 pm

Would love to get some feedback on Spendthrifts Breed Secure program. Good, Bad

What risk is there that I am not seeing?
I know they tell you what sale to go to which could be a little more costly, anything else jump out?

Has anyone used the Breed Secure program and want to share there thoughts?

Sysonby · Postby **Sysonby** » Fri Jan 11, 2013 6:36 am

wgc517 wrote:
What risk is there that I am not seeing?
I know they tell you what sale to go to which could be a little more costly, anything else jump out?

If you take the long view, the risk is probably that you breed to a mediocre unproven stallion and especially a young mare can lay a fat goose egg in the middle of her most productive years. Mares only have so many babies and chances to prove themselves.

karenkarenn · Postby **karenkarenn** » Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:18 pm

I agree you just don't know what you are going to get, no matter how good YOU think that stallion is... He may not be that.... Now you have two babies by him....

milhouse241 · Postby **milhouse241** » Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:55 pm

Into Mischief was on one of their programs like this. Obviously, not available anymore.

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Sat Jan 12, 2013 12:04 pm

I think the program is structured to share the risk - ie: first of all it is a
"limited" number of seasons available, like 40 or something, to help secure the first two books. Then the lifetime breeding right owner is in the canoe with Spendthrift for that third book. By the fourth and fifth books, there are results and if the horse is a bust it is a bust for everyone. I think books three and four are the toughest for new stallions. Five is go big or go home (or to Louisiana or somewhere else).

I much prefer this business model to that of some other farms that milk those first two years and then immediately ship the stallion out of KY, leaving the first two books' breeders holding the bag.

wgc517 · Postby **wgc517** » Sat Jan 12, 2013 12:22 pm

Thanks for the responses but I am asking about the Breed secure program. I think you guys are talking about the share the upside program where you get lifetime breedings.

I was wondering if anyone out there had participated in the Breed Secure where you breed your mare and sell the mare in foal and you get the first (10k), or sell the weanling (6k) or sell as a yearling (12k). Wondering if you would do it again or if you had any issues with the program.

milhouse241 · Postby **milhouse241** » Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:08 pm

We visited Spendthrift on last Sunday. Two of the other breeders with me are going to take them up on the Breed Secure program. I am good friends with one person at Spendthrift and becoming good friends with another. I think it is a straight up program and I would do it as well. Just that this year we have to breed everything in LA because we bred out last year.

BargainBlueblood · Postby **BargainBlueblood** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:53 am

There's no hidden or sneaky downside to "Breed Secure." You obviously have to like the stallion in question, and like the stallion with your mare, but all it is is Spendthrift taking on some of the risk on their unproven stallions. They want to fill these horses' books, and therefore they are taking some risk out of mare owners' corner in an effort to fill said books. I think it's a very nice program, and it protects you from a huge loss on stallion fee if your mare throws a small or crooked baby. I booked a client's mare to Into Mischief in 2011 on Breed Secure, and it's looking more and more like that was a very good move.