Kincsem picture?

[Mahubah]

Anyone ever seen an actual photo of Kincsem, the undefeated Hungarian wonder mare? I've seen the painting that gets in all the books, but wonder if an actual photo was ever taken. Would be interesting to see if her reputation for being homely was matched by fact.

[Michael]

Yes, there is an actual photo of her that I saw in the June, 1962 issue of the TB of California. A local breeder had obtained a direct female line descendant of this great mare and shared the photo with the magazine staff.

[Mahubah]

I had heard that there was a Cal-bred family descended from Kincsem. Do you know any more about it? Also, do you remember anything in particular about the photo? All the descriptions of Kincsem I've ever read make her out to be something of a feminine counterpart to the great gelding Exterminator: long, lean, rawboned, and nobody's idea of a beauty contest winner though mechanically pretty correct. Still, beauty is as beauty does, and by that standard she was gorgeous!

[Bill from WA]

Here is a paragraph from the Duke of Portland's book "Memories of Racing and Hunting" regarding Kincsem.

"I much regret that it was not my good fortune to be at Goodwood in 1878 to see the famous Hungarian mare Kincsem (ridden by Madden) win the Goodwood Cup, her only race in England. This wonderful filly, by Cambuscan - Water Nymph, was bred in Hungary by Herr E. Blascovitz. She was nothing much to look at, as may be seen by her picture, but by the end of her four-year-old career she had won no less than fifty-four races in France, Germany, England, and of course Austria and Hungary. When racing, she galloped with her head almost touching the ground, and much disliked it if her jockey tried to make her carry it in any other way. W. Waugh told me she was an excellent traveller, and that as soon as she entered her horse-box she lay down in the straw, sharing her bed with a Hungarian stable-boy, and keeping perfectly still throughout the journey".

The picture he refers to, is a painting in the book.

Bill

[Mahubah]

Thanks for passing along the description, Bill. Shucks, I was hoping for a real photo, but for anything or anyone before the early 20th century, that's pretty hit or miss, I guess. You certainly wouldn' have much luck getting a horse to stand still for one of the old daguerrotypes.

[Waternymph]

Here are the best pictures I have find...
http://www.thoroughbredvillage.com.au/e ... ncsem.html

[Bill from WA]

Thank you. Great stuff.

Bill

[Mahubah]

Ditto.

[Michael]

Mahubah,

I believe you are correct. Major Hartmann Pauly of Santa Barbara was a European immigrant who worshipped Kincsem and her kin. He supplied the photo of her to the CTBA. I haven't read that issue (the 25th Golden Anniversary of the CTBA) for a number of years, but as I recall Major Pauly had bred a filly tracing to Kincsem, who I believe was sired by *Toulouse Lautrec (a Tesio bred imported by Rex Ellsworth). From there, I don't know what happened to the family as Maj. Pauly (the full time bloodstock advisor to Eleanora Sears) died not too many years later.

If you contact Vivian at the CTBA (800-573-CTBA) and ask her to look in the June, 1962 issue of the TB of California I believe she will find this photo. You may be able to talk her into sending you a copy of it.

[Bettina]

Hallo,
Kinscem's family was introduced into Germanbreeding, with her 5th generations descent Winnica (by Kottingbrun) via her daughter Ollyan-Nincs (by Buccaneer). This family is still procuding groupwinners like Well Proved, Well made, Wauthi in my homecountry.

Her family had a Classic winner in Polygamy.

Regards, Bettina

[saintlyCZ]

I don't know whether you've seen this picture, but try it:
http://mujweb.cz/www/tbdiamond/Kincsem.htm

- only thing I can say it's MY websites (exactly - mine and my friends', who is our author of articles about legends) and I HAVE NEVER SEEN this picture! What a shame...

PS - Bettina: your info is always great! Kottingbrunn was stallion in Napajedla Stud and I have only brief list of his offsprings... Winnica is there too. Great to know about her, thanks!!!

[Mahubah]

I had never seen that particular portait before; thanks for the link. If the description in the other link and this portrait actually reflect the real animal, perhaps Kincsem was handsomer when fully grown than she was as a yearling.

[nferro9925]

Too bad I can't read Czech! That looked like it might be a good article.
I saved it anyway, maybe I can find someone to translate for me.

Thank you Waternymph. Yours is a very informative article!

I love reading about horses from the far past!

[saintlyCZ]

nferro: too bad we haven't enough time to translate it, it's my big dream to make English part of the website... However, I can translate it for you if you want, although I think there are no very special informations But maybe they are, who knows... we are very close to Hungary and connected with Kincsem much better than US, so I don't know what are "common" informations about her for you.

mahubah: yesterday I was searching in my old thoroughbred magazines and I found another drawing of her, not too known. It has too poor quality to scan it, but this picture is very similar to other known pictures, including that one on our website. On every portrait of her I've ever seen she looks like that... and her descriptions agree with those pictures... I think you can rely on those drawings.

[Jorge]

Did a little web "search" on KINCSEM and found this photo-like illustration:

http://www.angolteliver.hu/index.htm

Hope this may assist you.

Best Wishes,