Opinions on my mares pedigree please

feanixrising · Postby **feanixrising** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 5:43 pm

Hi I am new to the board and owning a TB. I have been searching the posts trying to find information on my mares background. I thought I might ask for some opinions too and would really appreciate some input from all the knowlegeable TB people on here.

Now I bought her essentially as a riding mare so I don't expect much of anything. I know she's never won and I did not pay a lot of money for her but would love to just find out neat stuff about her and her family line.
Her name is Sahara Sands and she is a '97 mare out of Selbirri and by Royal Egyptian. I looked up her pedigree on this site but only recognize a few names myself.
From what I have seen it seems she comes from a lot of blood that are good mare sires but am not 100% sure if that means how it reads. lol Terrible huh?
Help!

louis finochio · Postby **louis finochio** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 6:16 pm

Your mare Sahara Sands has the following sire lines 5 generations back. Ok lets have some fun thats what this forum is all about here we go. Sahara Sands has 6 crosses of (Phalaris) 1 cross of (Peter Pan) 1 cross of (Chaucer) 1 cross of (Tourbillon) 2 crosses of (Prince Rose) 2 crosses of (Swynford) 1 cross of (Teddy) 1 cross of (Hurry On) and 1 cross of (Gainsborough)

The foundation sires of the breed in Sahara Sands pedigree are: Nureyev, Princequillo, Tulyar, Double Jay, Northern Dancer, Nearctic, Hail to Reason, Prince John, Nasrullah, Prince Rose, and Blenhiem (GB)

If I owned Sahara Sands I would be dancing in the street as I have seen alot of 1st time buyers by medicore stock. Be Happy you have a quality mare in Sahara Sands. Good Luck in all your endeavours. Yours in Sport.

henthorn · Postby **henthorn** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 7:47 pm

Her sire Royal Egyptian was a fair racer who earned only about $80,000, mostly on turf, not surprising from his sire Theatrical. Sahara Sands has some Royal Charger and Northern Dancer in addition to many significant distance factors. If you are considering breeding your mare, don't go into it casually, because there are lots of expenses and lots of difficulties in getting a runner, in which case most racehorses don't make any profit for the owner anyway.

She has nothing to make a potential foal buyer take notice, and not enough racing ability in the first few generations to likely produce a good racehorse. You may want to consider developing a breeding program as you learn more, but I would not personally recommend breeding this mare. There are many unproven mares available at sales for very little money with better chance of success.

Jessi P · Postby **Jessi P** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm

Ditto what Henthorn said.

doublete · Postby **doublete** » Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:54 pm

From the sounds of the poster's question she just wanted to know the 'fun stuff' and interesting info about her mare's pedigree. I don't think she has any intention of breeding her for race, just wants to know any cool info that the normal every day person can't find as readily as you pedigree experts. :wink:

I know she's a nice mare, and would probably cross well with warmbloods, so I'm sure the posters intention would be leaning towards sporthorse babies, not race babies (especially considering she never won!).

henthorn · Postby **henthorn** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:05 am

Good idea. :idea:

I don't know from sport horses, but she might well make a good sport horse dam, with all the stamina influences in her background. And it is fun to see the little boogers scampering around as foals.

Didn't mean to demean your sweet girl, just didn't want to see you make expensive mistakes as many of us have, without researching it thoroughly.

Jessi P · Postby **Jessi P** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:03 am

Fenixrising you have a PM with more stat info on your mare, her dam and sire.

Bill from WA · Postby **Bill from WA** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:56 am

Hi

I agree with Jessi P and Henthorn about the race-breeding potential of your mare, but thought you might be interested in some side notes about her female family. Her conduit mare is Sallie Ward (who is a Classic/Stout influence). There have been some good ones tracing back to this mare including, Champagne S winner, Sarazen, CCA Oaks winner, Next Move, Spinaway Stakes winner, Now What, Prioress SW, Sometime Thing, and Spinaway SW Good Move. Next Move was the dam of Native Born by Native Dancer, who was at stud here in Washington State for a long time. Her broodmare sire, Sibirri, also stood here for awhile, and sired a few fair sprinters. Sahara Sands is very stoutly bred, with a speed to stamina ratio of 8/15. Not much to recommend close up in a catalog page, but with her profile, she shoud make a good sport horse broodmare prospect. Best of luck with her. Glad you got her, sounds like she'll have a good home.

Bill

feanixrising · Postby **feanixrising** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:11 am

Thank you so much for all the wonderful information. I love my mare and do realize that she probably would not be a good candidate to foal a little racer. Maybe sporthorses if I do decide to breed her. Like I said I don't know all that much in the TB racing industry but have seen people mention certain lines tend to have better feet or worse temperaments and thought maybe I could find out some info on Sahara's family lines on here. I do appreciate the candidness of some of the posters and I expected that when I posted on this forum. That is why I posted. I want all opinions good and bad. I just wish I knew a little more about her. I see someone mention stamina in her lines and in my research I am getting the impression she comes from a line of late bloomers. Also I have heard Princequillo lines have a tendency towards good feet. I am just learning and though Sahara may not be a good candidate for TB racehorse breeding it has made me get involved with all you wonderful people and excited about the sport. Maybe the next one I get will have better lines and be a better candidate.

henthorn · Postby **henthorn** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:37 am

Welcome to the board, feanixrising

. I was new here in January, just brought a lot of trial-and-error experience to the board

. Here I've learned a lot of posted information and learning resources to help improve my breeding skills. I've told Pete he is a big part of it

, but he rejects that idea :roll:

. There are a lot of generous people on this board, some just more tactful than others

. I've never been known for mine, but at least I can proofread and edit my posts before I hurt too many peoples' feelings very often. (unlike when I open my big mouth in person) :oops:

Never be afraid to ask what seems too simple a question. Somebody else is probably wondering about the answer, too.

Ruffian · Postby **Ruffian** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:06 pm

Henthorn, love the use of the smilies! it makes every one of your posts more enjoyable reading!!!

feanixrising · Postby **feanixrising** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:17 pm

Would someone help me out here and explain to me what the speed to stamina ratio is that Bill mentions in his above post. I am new to all this terminology so am a bit clueless about it. I apologize in advance for being such a dunce. lol I am willing to learn and a quick study though.

Thank you all for helping me get acquainted with all of this. I really appreciate it.

Bill from WA · Postby **Bill from WA** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:35 pm

Hi

Sorry for the confusion. That is a ratio created by the application of the conduit mare profile, which is based on female family influences. This is something that I came up with and is pretty new. It has been discussed (off and on) on this board for awhile now. The Speed/Stamina ratio is simply the number of speed influences (B & I) traced to the conduit mare of each individual within a 4 generation pedigree (tail female circa 1900), as opposed the the stamina influences (S & P) using the same criteria. Each conduit mare is assigned an aptitudinal rating based on the performances of their better descendants. Many thousands of races were analyzed to evaluate the data.

Bill

feanixrising · Postby **feanixrising** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:15 pm

Thank you so much. I am enjoying learning about this stuff. It is really neat.
I was on a long hiatus from horses (18-20 years) until last year when finally, I purchased one again. Now a year later I am also the proud new owner of Sahara Sands and am finding it is opening new and exciting doors for me. I want to learn as much as I can and I thank you for helping me.

BJ · Postby BJ » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:47 pm

Jessi P wrote:Fenixrising you have a PM with more stat info on your mare, her dam and sire.

O.k...is this some kind of "code" I'm not getting :?: