AP Trainwreck....

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MidwestTrainer
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AP Trainwreck....

Postby MidwestTrainer » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:52 pm

Well, I've watched the first 3 races at AP today. Two breakdowns, 2nd and 3rd race.

Wow, when this stuff goes bad, it goes bad. :shock:

horsenuts
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Re: AP Trainwreck....

Postby horsenuts » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:56 pm

MidwestTrainer wrote:Well, I've watched the first 3 races at AP today. Two breakdowns, 2nd and 3rd race.

Wow, when this stuff goes bad, it goes bad. :shock:



Hate to hear that.... sounds like it has completely come apart. To bad as the early results were ultra-encouraging.


"Equitrack" at Remington Park had the same type problems. The polymers and oil wore out much faster then anticipated and problems started anew.


Patience is going to be required in finding the "ultimate surfaces" for US racing.

Rokeby Forever
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Postby Rokeby Forever » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:58 pm

NO main track breakdowns at Saratoga for the meet....the "ultimate surface" exists, only trendy idiots think they can discover better.
What synthetics are to California racing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

Tiz
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Postby Tiz » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:12 pm

What is happening to it, MWT? Is it getting too fluffy so horses are stepping through it too easily? What do you think?

Foggytrip
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Postby Foggytrip » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:15 pm

Whats happened is they have tried to speed it up. You cannot do that and keep it safe. Plus its probably melting and deteriorating.
Last edited by Foggytrip on Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Rokeby Forever
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Postby Rokeby Forever » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:19 pm

When was the last time you heard or read that a trainer had a complaint about even bucked shins at Saratoga? Just food for thought.
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

Foggytrip
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Postby Foggytrip » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:19 pm

The ultimate track is a well maintained natural dirt surface. Not someones old Nikes and toilet toilet paper

Rokeby Forever
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Postby Rokeby Forever » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:20 pm

^5, Foggy!
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

horsenuts
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Postby horsenuts » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:24 pm

Rokeby Forever wrote:When was the last time you heard or read that a trainer had a complaint about even bucked shins at Saratoga? Just food for thought.


Saratoga has an excellent track.... UNTIL they speed it up and then problems start. The Oklahoma training track at Toga is praised by many and preferred by most. I've LONG advocated tracks emulating it and installing a similar surface.... but tracks are not interested in SSlllloooooowwwww times so no one will step up and do what is right by installing a DEEP safe dirt track. Sad but true.

Tiz
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Postby Tiz » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:34 pm

I have to say I'm not a synthetic surface fan. It seems a case of style over substance, feel good over reality. Apparently, a well maintained, average speed track isn't flashy enough. That's the 21st century for you.

Rokeby Forever
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Postby Rokeby Forever » Fri Aug 10, 2007 3:05 pm

horsenuts wrote:Saratoga has an excellent track.... UNTIL they speed it up and then problems start. The Oklahoma training track at Toga is praised by many and preferred by most. I've LONG advocated tracks emulating it and installing a similar surface.... but tracks are not interested in SSlllloooooowwwww times so no one will step up and do what is right by installing a DEEP safe dirt track. Sad but true.


EXACTLY!!!!!

That's why advocates of this synthetic crap and Polyshit are full of it. If they're truly interested in safety, they don't need to install this experimental garbage.

It makes you wonder....at $9 Million a pop for resurfacing, what's the kickback rate (no, not from the surface) for installing this garbage? $100K to the track president, $100K to the racing secretary, $250K to the board of directors.....?
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

smeehan
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Postby smeehan » Fri Aug 10, 2007 6:45 pm

We have horses at Arlington currently. There was a ton of rain this past week, and the poly always speeds up after the rain. They don't pack it like they did when it was dirt dirt, and I don't think they do anything to make it faster--it seems to be a byproduct of the moisture. It has been this way consistently after every good rain. The trainers I've heard think Arlington maintains their poly in a very good manner. Of course, I'm sure there are others who would disagree!

MidwestTrainer
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Postby MidwestTrainer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 3:00 pm

There have been a couple of updates in the Del Mar post, but AP had a breakdown yesterday, a graded stakes runner, and another today in the second. The card is 1/2 over today.

ratherrapid
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Postby ratherrapid » Fri Aug 17, 2007 3:28 pm

should they begin looking at the responsibility of the stewards?
my understanding, by state law, the steward's run the race meeting.

should trainers of horses with fatal breakdowns be put under stewards's inquiry:
1. galloping and breezing schedule pre-race
2. pre-race diagnostics
3. examine the tape and look at the warm up of the horse.
4. veterinary report on cause of injury
5. jockey's report on what happened.

and trainer on immediate probation for any negligence uncovered.

anybody think this sort of thing might aid in the breakdown problem?

tinners way
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Postby tinners way » Fri Aug 17, 2007 4:40 pm

Maintenance, maintenance, maintenance. Oh, and common sense 101.

The industry was way too quick to declare poly the second coming, especially when you have such variations in the mixes. I am hopeful to keep mine running only on the real thing. We ran on the BS at Remington when it was first installed- lot more than just footing problems. Horses inhaling the material developed some pretty nasty infections and breathing problems.

Each track has always been different. But safe is in my mind is simply spending the money to maintain the surface. I think the poly tracks think or thought that poly would require a lot less maintenance, and that is just not going to be the case.