A Racing Forum Without Picking Winners ...

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Whirlaway
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A Racing Forum Without Picking Winners ...

Postby Whirlaway » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:18 pm

Is like owning a horse and not entering him in a race!

What good is a racing forum if you don't post your picks? Tell me where is the fun in not handicapping a race? Can't understand why people are afraid to pick a horse. Must be fear of losing or fear of embarassment :shock:



Florida Derby: It'll be interesting to see if Sharp Humor can sustain his speed and what Barbaro has after eight weeks off. This one points to Flashy Bull.

Spectacular Bid Stakes: Will we ever see another serious horse like the Bid? Can't see how they beat Exclusive Quality in this one.

Winstar Derby: Interesting race. Only one horse has gone the distance and he dropped off the deep end last two outs. I think the Baffert horse comes in fresh with strong works. Wanna Runner gets the nod here.
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Sam
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Re: A Racing Forum Without Picking Winners ...

Postby Sam » Sat Apr 01, 2006 2:27 pm

Whirlaway wrote:What good is a racing forum if you don't post your picks?

Because "discussing racing" and "acting like a tout" are two different things.

"Racing" does not equal "handicapping"

Discussing certain horses in certain races is one thing. Posting "4 horse in the 10th at Will Rogers is a mortal lock" is something else.

People start making tout posts and the forum sinks fast from lack of interest.

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Whirlaway
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Postby Whirlaway » Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:31 pm

Like it or not, horseracing is all about winning.



And to the contrary, a horse racing forum without those involved making picks, if just for fun, makes for a dull forum lacking energy, excitement and enthusiasm; kinda like your post. :wink:

It was interesting and fun for me to handicapp those three races, certainly much more fun than not doing so. Some fear making a pick, I'm not one of them.
Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions. - William O. Douglas

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It is the characteristic of the most stringent censorships, that they give credibility to the opinions they attack. - Voltaire

wilf
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Postby wilf » Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:15 pm

Well my horse Flashy Bull was NEVER travelling well after being ridden along from the gate. His future probably lies away from the Derby trail on the lucrative provincial circuit.......pity, he just does not move well. Without a doubt we saw a very talented horse in Barbaro, well trained for this $1000,000 race and a great Derby finish too! That horse Sunriver may well be one to follow come Travers time, he ran a very promising 3rd.

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Heidilady
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Postby Heidilady » Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:48 pm

Whirlaway wrote:And to the contrary, a horse racing forum without those involved making picks, if just for fun, makes for a dull forum lacking energy, excitement and enthusiasm; kinda like your post. :wink:


That was kinda rude. Don't see the point of winking after you say it to soften the whole thing either. Sam's made pretty interesting posts if you must know. We have plenty of fun here without that "this horse will win!" stuff 24/7 (we do it often enough from what I can see, e.g. the Flashy Bull thread) and my self-worth isn't tied up in picking who'll take fourth at some podunk race at Turf Paradise or Mountaineer. I'm more concerned with who won or will win from a pedigree standpoint. This is a pedigree forum not a 'who's racing right now forum' so we work from that somewhere deep down. It may be an obscure connection at times but it's there. Racing's part of it but it's only one subforum here. I do love my racing but the horse doesn't have to be one I think will win to get my interest. Sometimes people talk Thoroughbreds and don't mean ones that currently race *gasp* :shock: It could be their retired racehorses, using TBs for police or therapy work, or breeding for sport horses. If someone on this forum has a horse running or knows about one, we consider them sort of hometown horses and root for them for sentimental reasons.

You want nothing but winner picking, the ESPN boards are the place to go. They've mostly run me off cuz there's so many obnoxious people sniping at each other and going off topic and when you try to tell them to talk horse racing, they yell at you like you're the spawn of Satan with the ever popular 'how dare you' thrown in there.
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Whirlaway
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Postby Whirlaway » Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:31 pm

My thinking handicapping this one was that SH and Barbaro would fade and be passed by the Bull who I thought would be in the best form. But after watching the video I must agree, the Bull just wasn't travelling well for this one. He just couldn't keep up with that deadly speed up front as he usually does and although he was only three or four lengths back at the quarter pole he looked outclassed. I thought this was his best shot to win one but he just didn't have it, probably never did. That Sharp Humor looked tough and The Barbaro may be the Derby Favorite. Looking forward to The Blugrass Stakes ...


Ms/r? Heidilady,
Interesting you found my post rude but not the post put forth by Sam. Clearly a doublestandard as rude is rude ... isn't it? Probably has something to do w/me not being a groupthinker or member of the clique. And your statement, "I'm more concerned with who won or will win from a pedigree standpoint. This is a pedigree forum not a 'who's racing right now forum' so we work from that somewhere deep down", is well written and w/all due respect you very well should consider your own advice as last I checked this section of the forum is RACING and the PEDIGREE section is lower down on the Forum front page. :wink:
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It is the characteristic of the most stringent censorships, that they give credibility to the opinions they attack. - Voltaire

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Postby louis finochio » Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:09 pm

To Whirlaway: When I compared FB ped to Barbaro ped I found that FB pedigree to be many lenghts behind Barbaro.

As FB pedigree has more undesirable ancestors than does Barbaro.

On FB best day maybe he can give Barbaro some competition, time will tell.
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Sam
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Postby Sam » Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:00 pm

Whirlaway wrote:Interesting you found my post rude but not the post put forth by Sam.

Probably because there was nothing "rude" about my post. It was a clarification of terms and statement of facts that wasn't specifically directed to you at all, Whirlaway. You were merely quoted as a jump off point for my post.

If I were planning on being 'rude' (which most people here know I have no qualms about doing), I would have specifically said "Discussing certain horses in certain races is one thing. Posting '4 horse in the 10th at Will Rogers is a mortal lock' is something else. A distinction that you are clearly too stupid to make."

I might also go on to point out that your puerile behaviour of putting "The" in front of every horse's name once you've realized I'm reading a thread -- clearly done because I stated it's a pet peeve when people screw up a horse's name -- does nothing but make you look like an immature ass who never bothered to grow up and realize he's no longer in junior high school.

Again, despite what you apparently believe, "Racing" is NOT synonymous with "handicapping." "Racing" is generally accepted to be a catch-all term used to discuss upcoming races (of which "Handicapping" is only one very small part of) and how you feel they might unfold or post race discussion of why certain things happen.

Posting:

Florida Derby: It'll be interesting to see if Sharp Humor can sustain his speed and what Barbaro has after eight weeks off. This one points to Flashy Bull.

Spectacular Bid Stakes: Will we ever see another serious horse like the Bid? Can't see how they beat Exclusive Quality in this one.

Winstar Derby: Interesting race. Only one horse has gone the distance and he dropped off the deep end last two outs. I think the Baffert horse comes in fresh with strong works. Wanna Runner gets the nod here.

Basically makes you look like you want to be a synopsis writer for the DRF and write their short little blurbs next to each horse.

It does very little to actually invite discussion of those horses and relies solely on the fact that someone somewhere MIGHT be inclined to post that they agree or disagree with you. If you've been online and around RACING newsgroups long enough, you know that isn't the case. Continuously posting "X horse is going to walk in Y race" doesn't do anything but make you look like a 'tout' and will get you ignored for the most part.

Additionally:

Whirlaway wrote:It was interesting and fun for me to handicapp those three races, certainly much more fun than not doing so.

No one said it wasn't fun to handicap a race. The question is, would it have been as "fun" for you to handicap those races if you didn't have some place you could post those pick with the potential of showcasing how astute a handicapper you think you are?

Whirlaway wrote:Some fear making a pick, I'm not one of them.

I doubt anyone 'fears' making a pick. It's more likely that most don't have the need for validation that you seem to have by making those picks public.

In my case, I'm not a handicapper. I don't gamble often. At most, I make 6 bets a year and 5 of those are often 'loyalty bets'. I've been lucky enough to hit a few nice exactas, but I don't handicap, I don't spend my days pouring over a forum and it would never occur to me to post why I think X horse might win.

If asked about a specific stake race, I MIGHT have a horse I'm looking at -- not because I've handicapped the race, but because there is something about the horse that has piqued my interest. I rarely bother to handicap Derby preps because they just don't interest me that much. I watch the class develop and I MIGHT handicap the Derby. I MIGHT handicap the Breeders' Cup as well. Unless there is some kind of online contest and someone specifically asks and I feel like answering (so don't bother challenging me, kid, because you don't rate and any challenge like you issued Bill would be summarily ignored), I rarely make those handicapping picks public. I watch horse-racing because I find it an enjoyable spectator sport. It's the same reason I love baseball but don't waste my days pouring over and memorizing stats.

I don't feel the need to say "X horse is going to walk off with this race" and then come back a few hours later and brag that I was right. I don't need that kind of public validation. I'm not that insecure. If someone wants to do it because they are pimping a system, whatever. I know it's a sales pitch and know to ignore it. If someone like YOU does it, I know you are looking for attention ... and I really don't like attention whores.

Was THAT "rude" enough for you?

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Whirlaway
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Postby Whirlaway » Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:53 pm

Wow ... that was a rather long winded existential rant. Got a lot on your mind do you?

Remember to remain civil and learn to check and put breaks on your emotions lest you be called in by the censors. And do please spare us your existential philosophy on racing, no one cares; this is the racing section of the forum. Should you need psychological and emotional counseling and relief, well ... call Dr. Phil! :wink:
Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions. - William O. Douglas

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It is the characteristic of the most stringent censorships, that they give credibility to the opinions they attack. - Voltaire

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Postby Sam » Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:50 pm

Whirlaway wrote:Wow ... that was a rather long winded existential rant.

Translation: Sam just made me look like an ass. Again. I am attention whore and she called me out on it so the only way I can comeback is with some pussified insult where I try to sound intelligent.

And that's twice now you've tried to insult me by alluding to my profile. Makes me wonder if you even know what an Existentialist is. I doubt it.

I'm vaguely getting the impression you're acting this way because you're still smarting over the Bluegrass Cat thing ... as if I might apologise and you'll stop. Not going to happen. I pointed it out politely TWICE that you had the name wrong, and you continued .. I made a smart ass comment about you doing it intentionally just to be a prick and that's when you flipped. If you're even entertaining the notion you'll stop if I apologise, you may as well forget it.

You've also managed to insult half the board by basically saying you think we're too stupid to know much about racing .. so under normal circumstances I'd question why you bother coming back .. but then I just have to remember you're an attention whore.

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Postby Heidilady » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:26 pm

Whirlaway wrote:This is a pedigree forum not a 'who's racing right now forum' so we work from that somewhere deep down", is well written and w/all due respect you very well should consider your own advice as last I checked this section of the forum is RACING and the PEDIGREE section is lower down on the Forum front page. :wink:


Er, *points to title of the entire website and gets confused that this is being challenged* Also "www.pedigreequery.com/forum" What am I missing even about the URL having the word 'pedigree' in it? Just a point that I'm confused by. Not being defensive. (Tone, I realize can be hard to judge in text online and people sometimes don't realize how things are meant)

There's no double standard. Sam's first post, which I went back and reread, was an opinion that tout posts have no place here and not a personal attack in any way. Disagreements are allowed here. Calling someone's posts dull is however a bit of a personal slam. I've only started reading the rest of the thread starting with the first post after mine and I have no doubt from the mild skimming as I used the ever so lovely page up function that things are getting a smidge heated. The best advice I can give is sure, post on the subject you want to post on, where you wanna post on it, and if it's a problem Roguelet will deal with it and if not and nobody wants to respond, then it'll go unattended and no harm no foul. People can walk away if they want and if not, well there was a demand for your threads. In fact, I don't know that it's as threatening as Sam or others might find it til you actually make the posts. It might fit in more than you might think. Give it a whirl, Whirlaway (no pun intended I swear..promise...cross my heart,etc :wink:.)
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Postby JimbleBrimble » Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:49 pm

Whirlaway wrote:Like it or not, horseracing is all about winning.



And to the contrary, a horse racing forum without those involved making picks, if just for fun, makes for a dull forum lacking energy, excitement and enthusiasm; kinda like your post. :wink:

It was interesting and fun for me to handicapp those three races, certainly much more fun than not doing so. Some fear making a pick, I'm not one of them.



If it were that interesting for you to handicap those three races, surely you'd be off doing just that somewhere else rather than sitting here trying to share with others that which they have little or no interest in knowing. By your own actions we can tell that your interest has little or nothing to do with handicapping but instead is centered around general buffoonery.

If it were the goal of most posters on this board to be surrounded by buffoons and realize it, we would all be AT the tracks, rather than be perusing these forums. You have to understand that so many of us work daily in the racing world that we come here for a break from the buffoonery.

Perhaps there should be a section of pedigreequery.com headed "Buffoonery" under which posts like yours and others who might arrive here under the guise of enjoying "handicapping" could be isolated away from the rest of us.

Or here, perhaps a better idea would be to handicap your three races a year/hour/day/month and simply print the names of your selections and place them under a refrigerator magnet at your house so that nobody else has to endure your touts. This way you can revel in the pure joy you get from (supposedly just) "handicapping" (unless of course your actual need is to suck others into having one interest or the other in what YOUR choices are doing)

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Postby StrawberryFelidos » Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:05 pm

Or here, perhaps a better idea would be to handicap your three races a year/hour/day/month and simply print the names of your selections and place them under a refrigerator magnet at your house


:mrgreen:

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Whirlaway
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Postby Whirlaway » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:41 pm

I believe one of the reasons this forum was created was to communicate different perspectives. No doubt all the nice words and wonderful compliments has something to do w/me not being a groupthinker or a member of the clique. I have never been a member of the "in crowd" as I find the mindlessness therein particularly unattractive. And to those few with all the nice things to say, I find great pleasure in all the compliments. :wink:

That being said, as I review the numbers I'm kinda leaning towards That Cause to Believe; he may merit a third book bet at 12-1. Of course my first picks, The Bluegrass Cat and Private Vow, we'll have to see how they do in the upcoming weeks.

Just checked Triple Crown Mania @ the Bloodhorse, That Cause to Believe is 30-1!
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Postby zinn21 » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:18 am

Whirlaway, just my opinion but I think Cause To Believe is overrated and this is coming from a NorCal guy. I think his Ill. Derby race will expose him. Might be eating crow but life's short and one must take a stand.

My pick is Lawyer Ron-he really impresses me. He's the toughest of the Derby bunch IMHO-showed a new a dimension last race, sitting off the pace then moving with a great turn of foot down the lane. I don't think Brother Derek can get the distance. I think Bob And John is the most underrated at this point. He threw in a flat race last out but had legit excuses. He's a tough campaigner and royally bred-trained by a proven Derby guy.