Pedigree Query

So much for thinking my breeding plans were done for this year...

I (rather unexpectedly) picked up 2 new mares this weekend: Cupid's Joy (an Alydar daughter) and In by One (by Lost Soldier)

Any feedback on their pedigrees, and/or suggestions on nice crosses? (PA stallions preferred!)

It's almost certain they'll both be bred to Five Eighty Four this year, but I'd like to look at my options, and I've only have a couple hours to think about it!!!

SymRanch wrote:So much for thinking my breeding plans were done for this year...

I (rather unexpectedly) picked up 2 new mares this weekend: Cupid's Joy (an Alydar daughter) and In by One (by Lost Soldier)

Any feedback on their pedigrees, and/or suggestions on nice crosses? (PA stallions preferred!)

It's almost certain they'll both be bred to Five Eighty Four this year, but I'd like to look at my options, and I've only have a couple hours to think about it!!!

No offense, but wouldn't a well thought out mating be a more sensible way to go, and offer better opportunity for getting a racehorse with a future?

Do you know anything about these mare's strengths and weaknesses? Wouldn't it make sense to find out before breeding them?

Hi!
Rubiyat has not had large foal crops but his foals have gone on to run.
One Tough Dude now a 4 year old has made $162,199 racing in New York. Rubi Echo has made $93,510 racing in New York and both of these horses are racing in $35,000 and $50,000 claiming races. Rubi Prince won a $10,000 claimer at Charles Town last year. Buteo won a $20,000 claimer at Calder on January 21. Mr. Crabapple won an allowance $29,000 at Charles Town on December 15. Gwens Pick won a $10,000 Maiden Special Weight. Rubiyat is in Pennsylvania and is throwing some hard knocking horses. He is by Rubiano-Blushing Madame by Blushing Groom. He is gray, graded stakes placed and never ran worse than second in his career. He would be a good stud that does not cost an arm and a leg to breed to and should throw you something that can run.

Keith

I agree with BJ; never get yourself rushed into breeding a mare. As the Proverb Wisely says: "Haste Makes Waste."

-llbean

I was really surprised by these replies. But now I'm thinking that maybe my post was mis-read as "I only have a few hours to think about it" ?? What I intended was "I've only HAD a few hours to think about it" (while what I actually typed was neither..... oops)

What I meant was that I would like to get feedback from this board on the strengths/weaknesses seen in their pedigrees, and I haven't had a lot of time to come up with ideas on my own so I'm completely open to suggestions....

My suspicion is that they might end up being bred to one of my studs, but only if that looks like a good option. That's why I'm asking.

Is that more clear?? Was that why I got the responses I did about not having a plan????

Hi SymRanch,

I read it as "I only have a few hours to think about it", not "I've only had a few hours to think about it". Sorry for the misunderstanding.

What are your studs names?

-llbean

I've got 2 stallions that I use in the sport/show side of the business (which is MOST of the business at this point) They are GPs Krugerrand and Argo's Quest. I'm not really expecting any racing advice to include them (although Argo's tail female IS through Bolero Rose -- so feel free to tell me he's my path to making the next Storm Cat!!)

Our new race-bred freshman stallion is Five Eighty Four, a Miswaki colt who ended his race career way too early with an unfortunate injury.

(My own fault about the misunderstandings. I was just in too much of a hurry and didn't even see the typo until I realized what everyone must have THOUGHT I said!!)

SymRanch wrote:I've got 2 stallions that I use in the sport/show side of the business (which is MOST of the business at this point) They are GPs Krugerrand and Argo's Quest. I'm not really expecting any racing advice to include them (although Argo's tail female IS through Bolero Rose -- so feel free to tell me he's my path to making the next Storm Cat!!) ;-)

Our new race-bred freshman stallion is Five Eighty Four, a Miswaki colt who ended his race career way too early with an unfortunate injury.

(My own fault about the misunderstandings. I was just in too much of a hurry and didn't even see the typo until I realized what everyone must have THOUGHT I said!!)

I would have thought someone would have responded by now... :shock:

Anyway...off the top of my head, on the Cupid's Joy (nicely bred), I would stay away from Native Dancer. You already have 3x5. My point is verified by her 2 foals of record by Senor Speedy. One didn't make it to the races, the other made very little. I'd look for a complete outcross that nicks well. Perhaps the Damascus line. That way, if it can't run, it may be a good sporthorse.

Copyright Bloodstock Research Information Services, Inc., 2003

CUPID'S JOY, 1990, Alydar- Cupecoy's Joy by Northerly.
YRS ST WN PL SH EARNED SR SSI
1995 Speedy's Joy,f,Senor Speedy Unraced
DP = 9-3-14-0-0 DI = 2.71 CD = 0.81
1998 Senor Quicky Ricky,c,Senor Speedy 1 8 1 1 0 6,450 ( 70) 0.29
North America Turf Record 1 0 0 0 0 ( 66)
North America Dirt Sprints 3 0 0 0 0 ( 69)
North America Dirt Routes 4 1 1 0 6,450 ( 70)
North America Muddy/Sloppy 2 0 0 0 0 ( 56)
DP = 9-3-14-0-0 DI = 2.71 CD = 0.81 AWD = 8.50

Copyright Bloodstock Research Information Services, Inc., 2003


CUPECOY'S JOY, 1979, Northerly- Lady Abla (Arg) by =Alsina (Arg).
YRS ST WN PL SH EARNED SR SSI

1984 Bundle Of Joy,f,Liloy (Fr) 2 14 0 2 0 14,760 0.93
North America 2 YO Record 7 0 1 0 6,600
North America Turf Record 4 0 1 0 6,720
North America Dirt Sprints 7 0 0 0 1,320
North America Dirt Routes 3 0 1 0 6,720
North America Muddy/Sloppy 2 0 0 0 1,440
DP = 10-7-7-0-0 DI = 5.86 CD = 1.13

1986 Bundle Of Money,g,Liloy (Fr) 7 41 3 11 3 82,162 ( 88) 2.12
North America 2 YO Record 1 0 0 0 0
North America Turf Record 30 3 8 3 62,362 ( 88)
North America Dirt Routes 11 0 3 0 19,800 ( 78)
North America Muddy/Sloppy 1 0 0 0 0 ( 70)
DP = 10-7-7-0-0 DI = 5.86 CD = 1.13 AWD = 13.90

1988 Alycupe,c,Alydar 2 19 1 2 6 50,640 ( 96) 2.04
North America 2 YO Record 6 0 0 0 3,000 ( 78)
North America Dirt Sprints 13 1 2 5 45,960 ( 96)
North America Dirt Routes 6 0 0 1 4,680 ( 80)
North America Muddy/Sloppy 2 0 1 1 9,060 ( 96)
DP = 12-4-20-0-0 DI = 2.60 CD = 0.78 AWD = 7.00

1990 Cupid's Joy,f,Alydar Unraced
DP = 12-4-20-0-0 DI = 2.60 CD = 0.78


1992 Special Bundle,c,Criminal Type 1 2 0 0 1 3,360 ( 80) 0.88
North America 2 YO Record 2 0 0 1 3,360 ( 80)
North America Dirt Sprints 2 0 0 1 3,360 ( 80)
DP = 6-1-11-0-0 DI = 2.27 CD = 0.72

1993 French Bundle,c,Hamza 2 7 0 0 1 4,850 ( 75) 0.33
North America 2 YO Record 5 0 0 1 3,980 ( 75)
North America Dirt Sprints 6 0 0 1 4,850 ( 75)
North America Dirt Routes 1 0 0 0 0 ( 67)
DP = 7-1-10-0-0 DI = 2.60 CD = 0.83

1994 Super Bundle,f,Capote 1 1 0 1 0 6,380 ( 79) 2.88
North America 2 YO Record 1 0 1 0 6,380 ( 79)
North America Dirt Sprints 1 0 1 0 6,380 ( 79)
DP = 8-0-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.14

1996 Speedy Lucia,f,Senor Speedy 1 3 0 0 0 0 ( 54) 0.00
North America Turf Record 1 0 0 0 0 ( 54)
North America Dirt Sprints 2 0 0 0 0 ( 45)
DP = 6-2-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.00

1997 The Genius Nick,c,Senor Speedy 2 3 0 0 0 520 ( 60) 0.07
North America Dirt Sprints 2 0 0 0 0 ( 60)
North America Dirt Routes 1 0 0 0 520 ( 52)
DP = 6-2-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.00

1999 Speedy Bundle,c,Senor Speedy Unraced
DP = 6-2-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.00

2001 Sicilian Boy,c,Senor Speedy 1 6 0 1 1 18,920 ( 78) 0.96
North America 2 YO Record 6 0 1 1 18,920 ( 78)
North America Turf Record 1 0 0 0 2,520 ( 78)
North America Dirt Sprints 4 0 1 1 16,400 ( 77)
North America Dirt Routes 1 0 0 0 0 ( 70)
DP = 6-2-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.00

SIRE 0.75 Spi, 140str, 27%2yo, 7%1st, 13%Mud/271sts, 13%Tf/165sts, AWD 6.9
DAM(sw) 0.93 Dpi, 7 2yostr/0wnr, 0%Mud/6sts, 4 Tfstr/1wnr, 7 Rtestr/1wnr, AWD 12.8
2003 Unnamed,c,Senor Speedy
DP = 6-2-6-0-0 DI = 3.67 CD = 1.00


IN BY ONE was never raced. Do you know why? That would be important to know. You also never mentioned where (what part of the country) you are located.

Copyright Bloodstock Research Information Services, Inc., 2003


IN BY SIX, 1990, Saratoga Six- Free The Princess by In Reality.
YRS ST WN PL SH EARNED SR SSI

1997 Icee Sara,f,Eskimo 1 8 1 1 0 13,071 ( 67) 0.64
North America Dirt Sprints 7 1 1 0 12,951 ( 67)
North America Dirt Routes 1 0 0 0 120 ( 34)
DP = 11-7-14-0-0 DI = 3.57 CD = 0.91 AWD = 5.00

1998 Half Past Six,f,Nelson 3 13 1 0 1 10,732 ( 61) 0.30
North America 2 YO Record 2 0 0 0 1,275 ( 61)
North America Dirt Sprints 13 1 0 1 10,732 ( 61)
North America Muddy/Sloppy 2 0 0 0 970 ( 47)
DP = 13-2-14-0-1 DI = 2.75 CD = 0.87 AWD = 4.50
Sold at Hip # Sales Price Sire Avg Rank Stud Fee
FTMOCT 1999 721 $3,200 $3,186 ylg ( 4/ 7) $3,000

1999 In By One,f,Lost Soldier Unraced
DP = 8-9-17-0-0 DI = 3.00 CD = 0.74
Sold at Hip # Sales Price Sire Avg Rank Stud Fee
KEESEP 2000 4113 $12,500 $14,050 ylg ( 5/10) $4,000

2000 North By Six,f,Lucky North 2 3 2 0 0 33,750 ( 88) 4.29
North America 2 YO Record 1 0 0 0 200 ( 66)
North America Dirt Sprints 3 2 0 0 33,750 ( 88)
DP = 11-3-14-0-0 DI = 3.00 CD = 0.89 AWD = 6.00
Sold at Hip # Sales Price Sire Avg Rank Stud Fee
OBSAPR 2002 0552 $22,000 $19,000 2yo ( 2/ 5) $2,500

2001 Soldier's Curfew,c,Lost Soldier Unraced
DP = 8-9-17-0-0 DI = 3.00 CD = 0.74
SIRE 1.32 Spi, 88str, 31%2yo, 6%1st, 11%Mud/131sts, 14%Tf/324sts, AWD 7.3
DAM(sp) 1.75 Dpi, 2 2yostr/0wnr, 33%Mud/3sts, 0 Tfstr/0wnr, 1 Rtestr/0wnr, AWD 5.4

2003 Unnamed,c,Kissin Kris
DP = 5-3-15-1-0 DI = 1.82 CD = 0.50

Thank you for taking time to look at this for me. Here is some more background/detail that I hope address the questions you've asked:

Both mares were owned by Haras Lucy Grace (Robert Perez). Neither has raced and they've only ever been bred to their own stallions (Treasure Cove and Senor Speedy)

Cupid's Joy was bred by Robert Perez, as was her dam. She was probably never headed to a track, as she was bred at 3. (Her dam, Cupecoy's Joy was a NY Bred, GW1 SW in the early 80s.)

In by One was bred by John Franks. I think she was acquired by Haras before she had a chance to see a track. I know she was bred as a 2yo, as she had a foal at 3 (died). I also know she's 100% sound. There might be more of a story, but I don't know it.

Both mares are now in PA.

I'd also appreciate if anyone can tell me more about the Haras Lucy Grace farm/breeding program. They had a number of mares at the sale, and I was told it was a total herd dispersal. I was just wondering if that's true.