darby dan

[da hossman]

Hi Bohemia - I really put family over sire in selecting broodmares. Often one can find value buying mares from good families by failed sires, especially sires that initially stood for a high price and had huge expectations. Those sires were bred to good mares, but when their offspring did not perform as well as hoped, their commercial value plummeted.

Likewise one can often find value in mares in foal to or by older quality stallions who have fallen out of fashion - look at how Gone West mares are selling at this sale.

So in regards to a mare with a fashionable sire but weak family, I probably would not be interested. And don't forget what a big role conformation plays in this especially if you are breeding to sell or to have that option.

[hpkingjr]

Hoss:

When you use the terms of art, "strong family or weak family", what is the criteria and depth that you are referring? Are you speaking tail female only or do you include other siblings and/or their daughters? I am always somewhat confused when someone uses those terms. Is there a standard definition for those terms within the thoroughbred industry or is it like the definition of pornography from Justice Potter Stewart, you know it when you see it"?

[da hossman]

Hi HPKING - Family refers to tail female, the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th dams etc. A horse that has a blank (no blacktype) 1st dam or even the 2nd dam can still be considered to have a strong family, especially if the 1st dam and 2nd dams are relatively young and the 3rd dam is strong. For me 2 blank dams is hard to overcome commercially, but that does not mean they cannot be productive racehorses. Of course you are betting that the family will breed on. The proximity of the blacktype is a pricing factor as is physical conformation, last bred date, production history, etc.

Also be aware that a strong family will have some "G's" in it - not restricted blacktype or only listed stakes....of course "strong" & "weak" are relative terms and if you are considering a regional market "G's" may not be necessary for that mare to be "strong" within that population.

So I can say definitively that "Family" is tail female. I might paraphrase your esteemed Justice Stewart to say that "strong" or "weak" is in the eye of the beholder!

[Tappiano]

I had second pick in their triple crown contest and was delighted to take Nobiz. The mare is a super, super match on paper (we got her after picking the season) and seems to be a good physical one as well. The main reason I did this is because adding in a new bloodline will give us a lot of options down the road if we get a good foal that deserves to contribute their genes to another generation. There won't be any AP Indy, the ND is far back, and there is not a lot of RAN either. The other reason why is because his pedigree is laden with stamina influences and that is something that is lacking in most these days. The foal will be 4 x 4 to Cormorant as well, something that I don't think has been done much. I hope that will add precocity to the foal since the dam did not get to the races until she was 4 because she is all legs and 16.2

And if you are an RF fan, Nobiz has that.

[oliverstoned]

I had second pick in their triple crown contest and was delighted to take Nobiz. The mare is a super, super match on paper (we got her after picking the season) and seems to be a good physical one as well. The main reason I did this is because adding in a new bloodline will give us a lot of options down the road if we get a good foal that deserves to contribute their genes to another generation. There won't be any AP Indy, the ND is far back, and there is not a lot of RAN either. The other reason why is because his pedigree is laden with stamina influences and that is something that is lacking in most these days. The foal will be 4 x 4 to Cormorant as well, something that I don't think has been done much. I hope that will add precocity to the foal since the dam did not get to the races until she was 4 because she is all legs and 16.2

And if you are an RF fan, Nobiz has that.

Wow tap very impressive! Love your plan, your reasoning seems sound and I love the 4x4 to Cormorant. As a side note I notice alot of Go For Gins's SWs are inbred to unconventional sires.

[Tappiano]

Time to necro this thread.

GiGi's in foal to him. Here's a new picture of her.

[LB]

Best of luck with her! I hope everything works out well for you.

I read your post above about wanting stamina influences. Where will you be racing the resulting foal?

[Tappiano]

Well, I don't know because at the time I made that post I was happily married, and my husband died on May 4th so I will have to wait and see.

Hopefully I can get some partners involved and then race it as a syndicate.

[LB]

I'm sorry to hear of your loss.

[Tappiano]

Thanks. 60 days after we found out he had metastatic cancer he was gone. It was only after I started the blog and talking to people that I realized how far reaching it was and that everybody knows someone who has died from this evil disease. His mother died a week after he did, but we had all been expecting that for many years so that was not a big surprise.

I submitted a name that we had both agreed on for this foal so hopefully the jockey club will let me reserve it

[Jessi P]

Tapp I am so sorry to hear of your loss. What a shock that must have been, to go from diagnosis to losing your husband in a mere 60 days. I might have said this before but it bears repeating, please accept my condolences and HUGS for you.

[Tappiano]

Thanks, Jessi. His wishes were that everyone gather at our local bar and get drunk in his honor so for those who can't make it we will be having a worldwide toast in his honor at 2PM EDT on the 26th.

[Jessi P]

Count me in!

Sounds like an excellent way to toast a man's life - much better than sending flowers.

[winds]

Tap so sorry to hear of your loss. Condolences to you and your family.

winds

[clh]

I am so sorry to hear of your loss - my thoughts are with you.

If it helps at all - we "LOVE" our little No Biz filly! "Strut" sure is fitting nicely into her name