Bernardini sons

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Affirmed1
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Re: Bernardini sons

Postby Affirmed1 » Sun May 12, 2013 9:59 am

[quote="merse"][quote="jlm"]Any information on Wilburn or the newcomers at stud by Bernardini? Thoughts on pedigrees and conformation please! Looking for KY location stallions.[/quote]

Sorry, this is probably too late of a posting to help out on your 2013 mating plans but I have a Wilburn filly and she is by far the best looking foal I have bred (keep in mind we are talking about a small sample size as she is the 13th foal I've bred). The filly is big, very correct, and good, solid bone. I was at another farm looking at stallions and the farm owner told me he heard from a consignor that had seen my filly that she was the best looking filly he had seen this year.[/quote]

Merse: what is your mare's name, if you don't mind sharing? Would love to look at the foal's pedigree. Any pictures available? 8)

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Postby merse » Wed May 15, 2013 1:09 pm

The mare's name is Saucy Countess by Tabasco Cat out of Fighting Countess by Ringside.

I'll have to figure out how to upload pictures as it has been a while since I've done that on this forum.

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Postby Affirmed1 » Thu May 16, 2013 5:17 pm

[quote="merse"]The mare's name is Saucy Countess by Tabasco Cat out of Fighting Countess by Ringside.

I'll have to figure out how to upload pictures as it has been a while since I've done that on this forum.[/quote]

Thanks! I love to study pedigrees. :)

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Postby erhrdt3 » Sun May 19, 2013 7:54 am

You folks just answered the same question I have been pondering for awhile now, and Dublino, I feel the same, the industry is going to be Overloaded with Bernardini's. WHY? The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.

Is it the 'drink of the year' or "Pantone Color of the Year" type of thing with him?

Just look at the difference between Zenyatta's two colts; one by Bernie, the other by Tapit. The Bernie one is awkward looking even as a yearling, and when pictured with others his age, looks like a inferior colt. Then look at the Tapit new fella she had; you can just see that much better shoulder, neck and rear end on him. Has a good head about him, and with Zenyatta being a good sturdy mare, this surely shows the difference between the two sires.

On another topic, what do all of you think of a Wild Again stakes winning colt being crossed with a Metfield (Slew) mare?

Thanks all, hope you all are doing great, happy and healthy, and Dublino, my bud, behave yerself now ;) LOL
We will NEVER see another Ruffian......

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Postby pfrsue » Sun May 19, 2013 10:13 am

erhrdt3 wrote:The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.


Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.

I'm sure that Bernardini winning the Jockey Club Gold Cup, Travers, Jim Dandy and Withers was just a fluke. And the Breeders Cup Classic? You're right. That REALLY showed what a hack ol' Bernie was as a racehorse. I mean who did he beat in that race? Only Lawyer Ron, Lava Man, Perfect Drift, Brother Derek, Premium Tap, Flower Alley, Suave, Sun King, George Washington, David Junior and Giacomo. What a bunch of slowcoaches, right? *sigh*

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Postby diomed » Sun May 19, 2013 11:38 am

pfrsue wrote:
erhrdt3 wrote:The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.


Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.

I'm sure that Bernardini winning the Jockey Club Gold Cup, Travers, Jim Dandy and Withers was just a fluke. And the Breeders Cup Classic? You're right. That REALLY showed what a hack ol' Bernie was as a racehorse. I mean who did he beat in that race? Only Lawyer Ron, Lava Man, Perfect Drift, Brother Derek, Premium Tap, Flower Alley, Suave, Sun King, George Washington, David Junior and Giacomo. What a bunch of slowcoaches, right? *sigh*


It just amazes me how much hate members of this board have against Bernardini. Geez, all the horse did was NOT break his leg and continue racing and he entered stud alive. The brewing hate of this horse just boggles my mind. It's one of the reasons I don't post that much over here.

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Postby docjocoy » Sun May 19, 2013 12:27 pm

diomed wrote:
pfrsue wrote:
erhrdt3 wrote:The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.


Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.

I'm sure that Bernardini winning the Jockey Club Gold Cup, Travers, Jim Dandy and Withers was just a fluke. And the Breeders Cup Classic? You're right. That REALLY showed what a hack ol' Bernie was as a racehorse. I mean who did he beat in that race? Only Lawyer Ron, Lava Man, Perfect Drift, Brother Derek, Premium Tap, Flower Alley, Suave, Sun King, George Washington, David Junior and Giacomo. What a bunch of slowcoaches, right? *sigh*


It just amazes me how much hate members of this board have against Bernardini. Geez, all the horse did was NOT break his leg and continue racing and he entered stud alive. The brewing hate of this horse just boggles my mind. It's one of the reasons I don't post that much over here.


I hope you realize that pfrsue was being facetious.

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Postby kimberley mine » Sun May 19, 2013 2:54 pm

pfrsue wrote:
Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.


And ALL of this is irrelevant to the given discussion, that being, whether Bernardini is likely to be a reliable sire of sires, and his own stallion performance.

To be honest Bernardini's stallion performance to date reminds me a LOT of what Coolmore did with Fusaichi Pegasus--the lone Derby winner by Mr. Prospector, had a few very nice runners early on, fee jacked to $125,000, and subsequently fell, and fell, and fell, to where he is now.

You can make the same pedigree comparison: Mr. Prospector out of a Danzig mare! (Quiet American, while not the overall sire that Danzig was, is fast becoming an absolutely amazing broodmare sire.) You can make the same performance comparison: Only son of Mr Prospector to win the Kentucky Derby! vs. Only son of A.P. Indy to win the Preakness! You can make the same comparison of him standing at a juggernaut farm with the same kind of intense, high-quality mare support behind him.

In his first crops, Fu Peg sired Bandini, Roman Ruler, Andromeda's Hero, and the gallant Australian-bred Floral Pegasus. Only one, Roman Ruler, is still in Kentucky. Bernardini has Wilburn, Algorithms, To Honor and Serve, Stay Thirsty, and Bold Warrior in Kentucky and a few more elsewhere. If Bernardini does a Fu Peg-esque decline, these sons will end up competing directly against the produce of their sire, rather than being the poor-man's version, which will hurt them commercially.

At this point, and I know Pete for one will disagree with me, I think that he's an incredibly risky gamble at $150k. A big part of that gamble is to get a To Honor and Serve, where the syndication price makes up for the initial outlay, but for that to make sense, the stallion has to be producing consistently very high quality. Right now, Bernardini is not producing that quality, nor has he produced it consistently enough (like, say, War Front) to up the chances of winning that gamble.

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Postby dublino » Sun May 19, 2013 3:54 pm

Stay Thirsty I think will make it, I can see him being another Tapit or Medaglia D'oro by that I mean getting good fillies.
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Postby erhrdt3 » Sun May 19, 2013 8:10 pm

pfrsue wrote:
erhrdt3 wrote:The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.


Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.

I'm sure that Bernardini winning the Jockey Club Gold Cup, Travers, Jim Dandy and Withers was just a fluke. And the Breeders Cup Classic? You're right. That REALLY showed what a hack ol' Bernie was as a racehorse. I mean who did he beat in that race? Only Lawyer Ron, Lava Man, Perfect Drift, Brother Derek, Premium Tap, Flower Alley, Suave, Sun King, George Washington, David Junior and Giacomo. What a bunch of slowcoaches, right? *sigh*


le 'sigh' no need to be rude on here again..
What I was trying to say is that is there going to end up being an over load of Bernie's out there? AND, for the record, I think he is a beautiful boy, but is too much, too much? Not too hard to think about??

Thank you Kimberley Mine :)
We will NEVER see another Ruffian......

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Postby pfrsue » Sun May 19, 2013 8:49 pm

In this thread, the OP asked: "Any information on Wilburn or the newcomers at stud by Bernardini? Thoughts on pedigrees and conformation please! Looking for KY location stallions." That conversation seems to have gone pretty far off course.

For my part, I will apologize to the OP for being off tangent of the intended conversation. I'm not going to apologize for making the point that Bernardini was a high quality racehorse who beat a lot of other high quality racehorses though. Losing to Invasor hardly made him a dud. :)



What I was trying to say is that is there going to end up being an over load of Bernie's out there?


That thread already happened. You started it yourself, erhrdt3. As I recall, it ended poorly.

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Postby kimberley mine » Sun May 19, 2013 11:32 pm

Of the lot, I actually like Algorithms quite a bit. I think he's fairly priced, he had a brief career but beat champion Hansen, multiple graded stakes winner Fort Loudon, and Virginia Derby winner Silver Max by open lengths in his single stakes start. Running a lights-out race in the slop probably compromised him, IMO. Female family consistently putting out stakes and graded-stakes quality horses, most males have been gelded up to this point so only now are they starting to go to stud. Claiborne has been doing a good job at getting young stallions started over the last few years, and he's an attractive cross for any First Samurai mares in their broodmare band.

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Postby diomed » Mon May 20, 2013 6:30 am

docjocoy wrote:
diomed wrote:
pfrsue wrote:
erhrdt3 wrote:The only reason he won the Preakness is because the Great Barbaro sadly broke his leg. And Invasor smoked him in the Classic.


Definitely. Let's ignore the fact that Barbaro and Bernardini never raced each other outside of the Preakness, so the question of who would have won if the breakdown hadn't occurred is pure speculation.

I'm sure that Bernardini winning the Jockey Club Gold Cup, Travers, Jim Dandy and Withers was just a fluke. And the Breeders Cup Classic? You're right. That REALLY showed what a hack ol' Bernie was as a racehorse. I mean who did he beat in that race? Only Lawyer Ron, Lava Man, Perfect Drift, Brother Derek, Premium Tap, Flower Alley, Suave, Sun King, George Washington, David Junior and Giacomo. What a bunch of slowcoaches, right? *sigh*


It just amazes me how much hate members of this board have against Bernardini. Geez, all the horse did was NOT break his leg and continue racing and he entered stud alive. The brewing hate of this horse just boggles my mind. It's one of the reasons I don't post that much over here.


I hope you realize that pfrsue was being facetious.

Oh, I do. My comment was more directed at erhrdt3, who has clarified their stance a bit better. It's all good. :D

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Postby erhrdt3 » Mon May 20, 2013 9:28 am

thank you diomed, I was just asking this as their has since been another foal crop born this year..

I could look at that avatar of yours all day of Slew running :wink:

No need for rudeness, my Heavens, life is too short for that!
We will NEVER see another Ruffian......

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Postby pfrsue » Mon May 20, 2013 10:02 am

It looks like there are some photos of a few Wilburn foals on the Spendthrift website. Not many, unfortunately.

http://www.spendthriftfarm.com/horses/wilburn-2793.html