Birdstone
Moderators: Roguelet, WaveMaster, madelyn
This is fun speculation.... but it all assumes that he stays where he is (which I expect will be the case). Yet, I cannot help but wonder how long it is before some Sheikh makes an offer?
Speaking of Sheikh's, don't you just love this game? A cowboy with a former $9500 yearling wins the Derby. A trainer in his first year wins the Belmont with another $10,000 stud fee Birdstone. Or was it $7500 LF for those two babies??
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springboro
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Re: Birdstone
dray33 wrote:Any thoughts on this guy... doing very well with only 62 runners (half as many as most other freshman sires). Also, interesting inbreeding if you have a storm cat family mare. You would inbreed to Storm Bird, but NOT storm cat... it's a Storm Bird mare. Thoughts?
Congrats, Dray! Summer Bird is bred exactly along these lines! Of course, my Aljabr mare looks like a great candidate (and he's small too!) but I bet he's way out of my price range now!
What a super year he and Md'O are having.
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bdw0617
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you know, I was doing what I do in my spare time, the little i do get, which is look up potential stallions female families, and I got to tell ya, Affirmatif and summer bird jump out of the page as far as female families compared to the rest of this 3YO crop. they of course are from the same family.
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
- Einstein
- Einstein
Bloomberg news has interesting blurb about Birdstone's fee
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... r=amsports
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... r=amsports
bdw0617
Not only is Affirmatif from this female family, but Tapit, Glitterman and Relaunch along with several other stakes winners decend from the 4th dam Foggy Note. Summer Bird is inbred 3X3 to Champion Storm Bird, a little close but if he can win stakes at a shorter distance he could very well be a good stallion prospect.
DDT
Not only is Affirmatif from this female family, but Tapit, Glitterman and Relaunch along with several other stakes winners decend from the 4th dam Foggy Note. Summer Bird is inbred 3X3 to Champion Storm Bird, a little close but if he can win stakes at a shorter distance he could very well be a good stallion prospect.
DDT
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bdw0617
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rubiano amoung others are from that family. very very good to be an owner of either summer bird or affirmatif..if he can win a graded stakes that isDDT wrote:bdw0617
Not only is Affirmatif from this female family, but Tapit, Glitterman and Relaunch along with several other stakes winners decend from the 4th dam Foggy Note. Summer Bird is inbred 3X3 to Champion Storm Bird, a little close but if he can win stakes at a shorter distance he could very well be a good stallion prospect.
DDT
okay... birdstone isn't what you woudl call commercial... do you think summer bird could be a commercial sire?
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
- Einstein
- Einstein
bdw0617
Belmont winners are usually not considered commercial, however, A.P. Indy and Empire Maker are two that have overcome any stigma attached to dirt winners at a mile and a half. If Summer Bird can win Grade 1 races at 1 1/8th and 1 1/4 he could go to stud as a hot item and be commercial for his first and second crops, but I think he is a long shot at becomming a commercial sire. If Birdstone is in fact passing on stamina he will rise to a level that could be considered commercial. A 50-1 Derby winner that had a dream run along the rail which apparently was the best part of the track and an 11-1 Belmont winner who also had a perfectly timed ride to pick up the pieces and win will allow for a hefty increase in stud fees, but, will that translate into high priced yearlings? Time will tell, Birdstone was a very good race horse and he brings more to the shed than most, but time will tell if that translates into becomming a commercial sire.
DDT
Belmont winners are usually not considered commercial, however, A.P. Indy and Empire Maker are two that have overcome any stigma attached to dirt winners at a mile and a half. If Summer Bird can win Grade 1 races at 1 1/8th and 1 1/4 he could go to stud as a hot item and be commercial for his first and second crops, but I think he is a long shot at becomming a commercial sire. If Birdstone is in fact passing on stamina he will rise to a level that could be considered commercial. A 50-1 Derby winner that had a dream run along the rail which apparently was the best part of the track and an 11-1 Belmont winner who also had a perfectly timed ride to pick up the pieces and win will allow for a hefty increase in stud fees, but, will that translate into high priced yearlings? Time will tell, Birdstone was a very good race horse and he brings more to the shed than most, but time will tell if that translates into becomming a commercial sire.
DDT
It always seems to me that Belmont winners have to prove themselves in the breeding shed before they can get anything close to a 'top' stud fee. It's very important that they prove their Belmont win was not a one-top-race fluke win before retiring AND that their connections are very judicious in choosing/selecting mares for those first two years+ they are at stud to maximize their chances - i.e. selecting/soliciting matings via special offers to mares that won't combine to produce a horse that can run all day but is too slow to get those GSWs. It's actually because of this negative bias against the Belmont winner who goes to stud that when they have success I feel it's a genuine proof that the traits of stamina and heart are being passed along - I tend to believe these offspring are the result of more thoughtful breedings instead of a mass marketing campaign designed for the Sales Ring.
Lemon Drop Kid comes to mine as a very successfully managed sire who won the Belmont, who's stud fee has increased with his progeny's successes.
Birdstone is IMO following in LDK's hoofprints as a Belmont winning sire and has been well managed at stud in the early going. His lack of size and all that stamina put off some breeders but those that bred appropriate mares to him have been rewarded on the track, not so much in the Sales Ring yet. Summerbird shows that not all Birdstone's are on the small side and MTB shows that even when they are if the talent is there it doesn't really matter.
Waiting to see how Jazil does. He poses a very different sireline/pedigree matchup for most N.A. mares. I doubt he'll produce the sort of physically muscular/massive specimen's that the N.A. markets seem to go crazy over. Any thoughts?
Lemon Drop Kid comes to mine as a very successfully managed sire who won the Belmont, who's stud fee has increased with his progeny's successes.
Birdstone is IMO following in LDK's hoofprints as a Belmont winning sire and has been well managed at stud in the early going. His lack of size and all that stamina put off some breeders but those that bred appropriate mares to him have been rewarded on the track, not so much in the Sales Ring yet. Summerbird shows that not all Birdstone's are on the small side and MTB shows that even when they are if the talent is there it doesn't really matter.
Waiting to see how Jazil does. He poses a very different sireline/pedigree matchup for most N.A. mares. I doubt he'll produce the sort of physically muscular/massive specimen's that the N.A. markets seem to go crazy over. Any thoughts?
jellac
It is interesting that you mention Lemon Drop Kid because he is the type of Belmont winner that demonstrated stakes winning ability at 2 and 4 as well as his 3 year old year, and won at less than a mile and a half, however, Jazil apparently needed the mile and a half to win, other than his maiden win. I think he will have a very difficult time siring winners and IMO he is not in the category of Lemon Drop Kid or Birdstone, but stranger things have happened.
DDT
It is interesting that you mention Lemon Drop Kid because he is the type of Belmont winner that demonstrated stakes winning ability at 2 and 4 as well as his 3 year old year, and won at less than a mile and a half, however, Jazil apparently needed the mile and a half to win, other than his maiden win. I think he will have a very difficult time siring winners and IMO he is not in the category of Lemon Drop Kid or Birdstone, but stranger things have happened.
DDT