Pedigree Query

Hubby and his brother want to stand a stallion in Ontario for next year. Here are some prospects that they would like your opinion on. They are all the range of $20-40,000US. Do any have commercial value? What would you pay for each one? Or should we pass on all of them? I don't have pictures to post but they passed our initial conformation review. We really would appreciate your opinions! Oh and are there others you might recommend. You can PM if you prefer. Thanks!!!!

http://www.pedigreequery.com/second+in+command

http://www.pedigreequery.com/ingot9

http://www.pedigreequery.com/intensifier

http://www.pedigreequery.com/al+mukhtar

http://www.pedigreequery.com/kaseh

I saw Al Muktar before he sold for $15,000 at the Jan sale. Very nice looker. As a stallion prospect, I found his female line to be a bit weak.

crazy canuck wrote:Hubby and his brother want to stand a stallion in Ontario for next year. Here are some prospects that they would like your opinion on. They are all the range of $20-40,000US. Do any have commercial value? What would you pay for each one? Or should we pass on all of them? I don't have pictures to post but they passed our initial conformation review. We really would appreciate your opinions! Oh and are there others you might recommend. You can PM if you prefer. Thanks!!!!

http://www.pedigreequery.com/second+in+command

http://www.pedigreequery.com/ingot9

http://www.pedigreequery.com/intensifier

http://www.pedigreequery.com/al+mukhtar

http://www.pedigreequery.com/kaseh

I really don't think any of them will make you any money. I remember Al Mukhtar selling at Keeneland for 17,000 and I thought that was a bit much. Kasek brought 12,000 this January. Second In Command would bring less than 10,000 in the best sale. Ingot has the best bloodlines and might have some commercial appeal but the picture left me cold, just another horse to me. Personally I like the blood of the Intensifier horse. I doubt he would bring 15,000 in a sale. I like him because I think you might get some vigor from Northern Dancer bred mares but he would have to really be a looker for me to consider him.

Goodness, look at the female line on Second In Command! Of all the ones on there, he's the one who seems most likely to appeal to the Ontario market.

He'd be a natural cross for mares carrying Bold Ruckus (check out Silver Deputy's produce with Bold Ruckus) AND with Sam-Son foundation blood. His 2nd dam That's a Kennedy is a half sister to No Class. Lots of potential with Regal Classic, Sky Classic, and maybe even Smart Strike (if you don't mind the inbreeding to Mr P) there. This female line is proven with a return of Classy Quillo, as evidenced by the stakes-winning Sky Classic filly Carolina Sky.

Second in Command also has the best race record of the bunch, with two stakes wins and a couple of stakes placings. None of the others have any race record worth writing home about.

I second Second in Command. How's that for repetitive? With that said, Al Mukhtar is from one of my favorite families. Very active and consistent clan.

I agree with Maven...

Rokeby Forever will enjoy the storm cats/unbridleds song...

I'd be curious to know why most of their race records are so lacking, atleast 2 of them with only 2 starts that I noticed....
Intensifier is the horse they've been peddling for several issues in the classifieds of the Blood Horse. He's listed as 'sound and attractive' but he only managed two starts in 3 years....neither of which was a win. How sound do you have to be to run twice in three years?? Then again, his half brother didn't run much either so he gets a double whammy from the dam and sire's side apparently. Being a half to a champion and classic sire he'd probably have as much appeal as the Storm Cat/Catinca.

I agree that Second in Command is the best of these choices.

My concern with Second in Command is that there are already four Silver Deputy sires in Ontario.

I would want to compare pedigrees, perfomance, and mares bred to see how Second in Command stacks up and might be an indicator of how many mares might come his way.

Any thoughts on where he would fit fee wise?

Crown Attorney Silver Deputy Debany Farm ON Private 2000
Eh Silver Deputy Branview Stables ON 1,500 2003
Hotoffthepress Silver Deputy Hillside Acres ON Private 1997
Mr. Jester Silver Deputy Colebrook Farms Stallion Station 3,000 06

Second in Command stands up pretty against the other Silver Deputy's.

What's most interesting is the female family behind him and the options it opens up with the RF.

You'd be catering to a large population of mares and would have an added bonus of advertising what is arguably the best Canadian family around.

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Do you need a grass horse up there? A dirt/grass pedigree? Sprinter, router, mudder, Polytrack?

These pedigrees speak to different breeding. Kasheh is bred for speed, but apparently didn't have much.

Second in Command appears the most balanced on paper.

The key to standing a stallion is of course matching the stallion with the local market.

For years, grass horses have failed in California, for instance, because there is a market bias against them. Even though there have always been a goodly number of grass races in that state.

So, the point is, make sure you know what people want, and then provide it.

Thank you everyone for your help. I should have mentioned that the market I'm targetting is Woodbine and they have polytrack. It looks like Second in Command is the clear winner which is what I was afraid of because at around $40,000 he's higher than what my hubby and brother-in-law want to spend. I took a look at the breeding histories of the other Silver Deputy stallions in Ontario and saw that Crown Attorney had some great years but has seemed to die off in terms of mares in his book. Eh and Hotoffthepress had terribly low numbers of mares since they entered the stud. The new factor is Mr Jester and from the 2006 Jockey Club report he seems to be off to a good start in his first year. So although I know Second in Command's female family is a selling point over these others, I would have thought there would be many more bookings to Silver Deputy studs given his fit with Bold Ruckus and the large market of BR mares.

I admit I'm partial to Intensifier and Ingot because of their bloodlines and it doesn't hurt that they are within our budget but I also don't want to just throw away hard-earned money!

So if Second in Command had to drop off our list, would you all say Ingot would be next? Also, I'll ask again if any of you know of any other stallions out there for sale in our price range. I've spoken to bloodstock agents but they really haven't turned anything up for us, I guess our price range isn't worthwhile for them. Thanks so much again for your help it is very much appreciated.

I like Second In Command way best, great female family, the famous 4x4 cross to Northern Dancer through his sons, and a 5x5 to Victoriana, as well as the best race record.

I suppose Ingot would be the second best, a stakes winning dam, some winnings at the track, not a bad female family, Buckpasser over Hail to Reason (which Rokeby would like), but his picture leaves me cold.

The others don't have enough race earnings and the inbreeding to Caro is too close in Intensifier.

I saw that comment, HR LLC.

Verrrrry funny....verrrrry funny. Grrr!!!!

I sent you a PM about another stallion for sale.