Pedigree Query

Will Chief's Crown be considered a classic sire line?
1. Erhaab by Chief's Crown-Histoire by Riverman- won Epsom Derby
2. Grand Lodge by Chief's Crown-La Papagena by Habitat- Champion 2 year old in England
3. Sinndar by Grand Lodge-Sinntara by Lashkari won Epsom Derby,Irish Derby, Prix de L'Arc de Triomphe.
4. Chief Bearheart by Chief's Crown-Amelia Bearheart by Bold Hour won Breeder's Cup Turf

Possible Kentucky Derby winner
Bellamy Road by Concerto-Hurry Home Hillary by Deputed Testamony


Keith

He is quite underrated, isn't he?

-llbean

To say the least in my opinion. I own two (possibly a third after future inspection to a Coronado's Quest half to a dam of one of my fillies) stakes placed fillies who are direct tail-female to Miss Carmie and the only thing I had hoped could improve for this family was the stigma of not producing a top sire. Chief's Crown was extremely useful and even near top tier, but never really got the respect he deserved.

My filly Coquinerie is by Sahm out of a Kris S. mare and my other filly Chitchat Chitchat is by Arch out of a Secretariat mare. I was looking at ways to inbreed to Miss Carmie and Bellamy Road might be that way. He hails from a very good sire producing family and have to love the Chief's Crown up top!

Hey, I say we find a way to keep this thread going all the way through to November... at least...

I love Chief's Crown and think him vastly under-rated... especially as a broodmare sire. It should be noted that Eddington is out of a Chief's Crown mare... as is Best of Luck... as are a couple of the top runners by sons of Storm Cat's. Talk about working with a variety of sire lines...

I say everyone should run out and spend as much as possible on yearlings and weanlings with Chief's Crown up close in the pedigree... especially as broodmare sire.

Of course, perhaps I am biased... I own two daughters of Chief's Crown. I will say that there seems to be two things to look out for in the Chief's Crown's: many seem to toe-in (but not necessarily pass it on to their foals), and many seem to have wonderful bodies (especially shoulders), but perhaps a little light of bone for these bodies.

hi KAL

You are the beneficiary of some good news.

It has been reported (brisnet.com) that Chief's Crown has officially been added as the newest chef-de-race in the intermediate/solid classification.

He is the 205th stallion to be included.

Congrats.

Respectfully

Thanks FOS!

That certainly is interesting news... and it will be interesting to see how if affects their dosages, etc. Anyone have the ability to make the changes to this site? (I know... I can figure the dosages and CD by hand... but...).

(George... does this have any bearing on the GSV?)

However, I have yet to see or hear that someone paid a dime more for a horse because of dosage, CD, Werk Analysis, or GSV. I won't go so far to say these may not have some influence... at some level... but...

What I do know is that marketing and "buzz" do tend to greatly assist the sales numbers of various horses and foals tied to certain "buzz" horses... so... I say we start and fully support the "buzz" for Chief's Crown mares, and their foals!

Actually, if anything, it puts a little more pressure upon me to mate these mares well and get quality individuals out of them. No breeder wants to one of a stallion's "failures", (or average anchors... as I have become fond of saying). I have always held that the better the bloodlines of your mare, the more responsibility a breeder has in seeing her be successful. Of course, I also view breeding as an art. (However, I also view and treat the industry as strictly business.)

I have a Chiefs Crown mare and love her...Her name is I will I will. She is tail female (3rd or 4th dam) to the dam of Erhaab....wish I could afford to breed her like I would like to...her first foal has earned over $110,000 and is still running. She is smallish but throws correct foals with nice butts. I bred her to Weekend Cruise this year

KAL wrote:Thanks FOS!

That certainly is interesting news... and it will be interesting to see how if affects their dosages, etc. Anyone have the ability to make the changes to this site? (I know... I can figure the dosages and CD by hand... but...).

)

The timing was certainly interesting. Bellamy Road spreadeagles a major Derby prep and within days it appears that his grandsire is now a "chef".

So does this make Bellamy Road a dual qualifier now?

KAL wrote:Thanks FOS!

That certainly is interesting news... and it will be interesting to see how if affects their dosages, etc. Anyone have the ability to make the changes to this site? (I know... I can figure the dosages and CD by hand... but...).

(George... does this have any bearing on the GSV?)

However, I have yet to see or hear that someone paid a dime more for a horse because of dosage, CD, Werk Analysis, or GSV. I won't go so far to say these may not have some influence... at some level... but...

What I do know is that marketing and "buzz" do tend to greatly assist the sales numbers of various horses and foals tied to certain "buzz" horses... so... I say we start and fully support the "buzz" for Chief's Crown mares, and their foals!

Actually, if anything, it puts a little more pressure upon me to mate these mares well and get quality individuals out of them. No breeder wants to one of a stallion's "failures", (or average anchors... as I have become fond of saying). I have always held that the better the bloodlines of your mare, the more responsibility a breeder has in seeing her be successful. Of course, I also view breeding as an art. (However, I also view and treat the industry as strictly business.)

Hey Kal,

I tried emailing you but it wouldnt go through. Can you email me again, I wanted to thank you and discuss a few things with you! Thanks! [email protected]

Hi KAL, Coquinerie, and Tom,

I think a very key strain for Chief's Crown is Alydar.

It is very interesting to note that Chief's Crown's 3rd dam Miss Carmie and Alydar's dam Sweet Tooth share such similar Calumet type backgrounds (it in fact being a female family reverse); and in fact this relationship inspired me to check the cross of Chief's Crown (3rd dam Miss Carmie) and Alydar (1st dam Sweet Tooth) a while ago and I discovered the Major Multiple GIWs Grandera and Excellent Meeting cross them close up. Very impressive stuff...

Bellamy Road may also point to a Caro/Miss Carmie affinity as they are crossed 4x5 in the Amazing Wood Winner and 1x2 in a little filly named Winning Colors, who won the Santa Anita and Kentucky Derbys against the Colts.

Another very good cross for Chief's Crown seems to be In Reality, the damsire of Concerto. Chief's Crown and In Reality have already combined in the G2W Concerto, the Japanese Champion Older Horse and Hong Kong Cup (HK-GI) Winner Agnes Digital, and the much above average G2W Eddington.

-llbean

Also, Chief's Crown and Never Bend have combined 1x3 in the Sydney Cup (AUS-GI) Winner Azzaam, 1x3 in the English Derby (GI) Winner Erhaab, 1x4 in the GI Placed G3W Key of Luck, 2x4 in the English Derby and 'Arc Winner Sinndar, and 2x5x6 in the Irish Derby and King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Diamond Stakes (GI) Winner Alamshar.

-llbean

I have to say that I absolutely love the Chief's Crown line. I have a 4 year old gelding by Concerto who is the spitting image of his daddy, I just hope that he can run 1/2 as good as him! He will start this summer...(long story). I flew to Ocala to look at Concerto before breeding to him. (I am in Michigan lol) He impressed me more than I can tell you. The manager at Ocala stud turned him out for me (they knew that I was coming but didn't feel the need to clean him up-full of mud-lol) ..but he showed off for me as if to say hey you can see what I really am through this mud right? He would run over to the fence and pose and then take off running..he did this several times and then stood for me to give him a pat.

I also have a great stallion by Chief's Crown, Georgia Crown- he is a joy to work with always considerate and patient (even when being handled for breeding by his novice owner ) He has covered 3 mares this year with one confirmed in foal! (covered 1 more yesterday- so I guess that is 4). George has an incredible pedigree, i love his entire female family and the funny thing is that when I bought him..I didn't know much about him, I didn't really start researching until I already had him.
My thoughts are GO BELLAMY ROAD!! you can do it!!

Here's the link to the designation page on Dr. Roman's site. It contains recalculations of some of the more prominent recipients of Chief's Crown blood.

It's good to see another source of US stamina come to light -- and IMO not a minute too soon.

Sstacy, I'm heading to the Ocala area in June and Concerto is on my list of "must see" stallions. It's funny...I had three stallions earmarked as stallions to watch for 2005 based on their pedigrees. One was Concerto. One was Atticus. Hmmm...interesting that they both came up with Derby contenders this year. Maybe my instincts are better than I thought. LOL

BTW, the third stallion I have on watch is Leestown. Don't know if he'll produce anything of the caliber of the first two, but he does seem to be climbing up the list so far this year.

Laurie

Lauie.. ha ha Atticus was on my Short list for my mare Ceasefire this year.. but he moved to KY..
I Wish he would have stayed at Three Chimneys!