Pedigree Query

Its early, but since there have been two notable retirements might as well get going. Hopefully they won't drop like flies like they did last year

Rockport Harbor: Darley at Jonabell No Fee Announced
Borrego: Wintergreen No Fee Announced

hi austique

I sense that Rockport Harbor be will be tagged as a colt that was prone to unsoundness/problems...and (as a racehorse) was a cut or two below the top. Pedigree-wise, I suggest that his 2nd and 3rd dams (by Banner Bob and Kamaraan respectively) might leave many cold. Mix this all together and I sense that the result will be a stallion that will have limited appeal...but throw his sire Unbridled's Song into the mix and his appeal arguably goes up.

As for Borrego (by El Prado), he might be tagged as a VERY good older racehorse that could compete and win at the TOP (examples...won G1-Pacific Classic, won G1-Jockey Club Gold Cup). As a sire prospect, I sense that he will be viewed by many as a potential source of stamina...but that he might not succeed in generating much in the way of excitement and/or market appeal as a young stallion.

After first glance at their pedigrees and resumes, I find Rockport Harbor to be of little interest...and Borrego (by El Prado) somewhat intriguing.

That said, I look forward to seeing both young stallion prospects in the flesh.

Whatta you think?

Respectfully

I think Rockport Harbor will be way more popular as a stallion prospect (at least in his early years). His bandwagon was HUGE as a young horse (and arguably still is) as he was tagged as the "Smarty Jones of 2005," having the same connections and showing early talent and all. The hype was enormous and I think it will still be big enough to carry him along. Plus his papa is Unbridled's Song, a fashionable fella at the sales.

Meanwhile Borrego is by El Prado, a not-so-fashionable grass sire, and Borrego was never considered to be the next Smarty or anything so hyped. For a long time he was believed to be a serious "underperformer" and he only got it together as an older horse. I don't think people will be expecting the precocious, flashy dirt babies out of him.

Part of Rockport's "Smarty" label was just from his connections. Had he been trained by Baffert or Zito, you'd never have heard it. Thing is, I do see him as a more flashy prospect than he's being given credit for. Soundness is a question but Rocky was never a cut below on talent...he had to stay sound long enough to race several times and couldn't really manage it but showed lots of talent when he did run. I just wonder how sound his foals will be.

I'm willing to cut Rockport Harbor a LITTLE slack on the soundness issue since most of his problems seemed to be self-generated (not really inherited physical problems, more the product of bad luck) but I think FOS is right. The bottom half of his ped leaves a lot to be desired as far as a stud prospect goes. He's not even close to being the best bred of the Unbridled's Songs.

As for the hype: Casual fans and the media, who know little to nothing about horse racing and not a damn thing about breeding, create hype. Breeders won't pay it any mind because they know it's a lot of BS and will evaluate the horse on his merit (pedigree, physical appeal and actual race record).

FOS,

I'm going to stick by my guns with Borrego and say that while I liked him as a racehorse, I'm not fond of him as a stallion. He was a bit of a backward horse and his sire isn't my favorite as far as sires of stallion prospects go. While he's got a consistent female family, I don't see him being terribly fashionable and would be worried that his late maturity would kill in the sales ring. Throw in the fact that to me from what I've seen of him on TV, he's not a horse I like that much physically (even though he's quite flashy ) and I'm betting he'll be overpriced, I'll pass.

I absolutely loved the way Rockport Harbor got across the ground and I'm willing to cut him a break on soundness due to his accident and possible mismanagment right after; however, he appears to be physically light and again no so fond of the sire (although I like him more than El Prado). Female line is also an issue. I quite like dealing with Darley, but he's not going to be at the top of any of my lists. I'll probably have a looksee, but doubt I'll use him or really even seriously consider him.

All things being equal neither one appeals to me much, but if forced to chose...hmmmm...yeah let me get back to you on that

Sir Shackleton: No Farm Announced No Fee Announced

Lion Tamer goes to stud in 2007 and like Sir Shackelton no farm or fee annouced, but the folks who bought him are based in Louisiana

Just curious along these lines do any of the stallion registries or websites have a tracker of stud fees and or deals. Like if a stallions stud fee is going up next year or down the next year or rebates for stakes winners out of a stallion. Anyone know of anything like that? Ever year there are sires that go up in price just wondering if anyone tracks it. I saw that Sweetsounthernsaint is all full this year and I would imagine going up in price next year.

Warrsan (*1998, Carleon-Lucayan Princess (High Line)) retired. Where will he stand in 2007 ?

Warrsan would be an awesome horse to stand in Germany, considering that Lomitas who is also a Nijinsky grandson did so well. Also considering the fact that Germany is still a great place for really good staying horses.

hi bonzer

Other than what I occasionally see on a sales catalogue page...I have little knowledge (and that might be an overstatement) re: thoroughbred horseracing in India.

Could you please share an overview of the thoroughbred scene in India; and how the racing and the racetracks might compare to TB racing in other countries.

Thanks.

Respectfully

Prince Arch: No Farm Announced No Fee Announced

Also if anybody wants the round about figure on Rockport Harbor's fee. PM me. It was uh not what I was expecting.

I wonder if Prince Arch will be standing in this country or if he will be shipped like most of the turf studs of late (Magistretti to India, Kickin Kris to Japan...) He did beat Kitten's Joy once but the latter beat him three times, which won't be reflected in the stallion ads Plus, Arch's fee is pretty low (15k) Prince A. would probably have to start off lower.

Very honest guy, not my favorite (I'm a Kitten fan, duh) but a nice fellow. Deserves a shot here if someone will stand him.

PS: Austique... no fair keeping secrets! Spread the word to us all

S.F. I would, but its a soft number and a lot can change between now and Oct when they told me they would publish the fee. Anyone can ask, just PM.