Wagon Limit again
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Derby2004
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Wagon Limit again
I know this has been discussed previously, but I cannot figure out why Wagon Limit is NOT commercial and why he only bred 15 mares last year. I mean he had Silver Wagon and his brother who are still racing and winning G1 events. He seems to be a nice looking stallion with great numbers. So why would mares not be going to him? Same with Intidab. Both can get a big horse fairly easily. I have not seen either ones babies, so Im assuming they arent as good looking as others.
The Conquistador Cielo sire-line was never respected much and CC never proved himself a viable sire of sires.
While on the track, Wagon Limit was undervalued. I think most considered him a "one hit" wonder and I think a lot of people are applying that also to his stud career.
He had/has every right to be a good, solid breed to race stallion and there's nothing wrong with that. Smarten and Quadratic also fit that bill in their time, and they're from the same direct female family. I think they would be a good guide to use on Wagon Limit.
While on the track, Wagon Limit was undervalued. I think most considered him a "one hit" wonder and I think a lot of people are applying that also to his stud career.
He had/has every right to be a good, solid breed to race stallion and there's nothing wrong with that. Smarten and Quadratic also fit that bill in their time, and they're from the same direct female family. I think they would be a good guide to use on Wagon Limit.
Don't be so humble - you are not that great.
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Rokeby Forever
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Wagon Limit had the misfortune of racing against the "good" Skip Away a bunch of times.
Maven, what do you think: When anyone thinks of CC or his line, they think speed (ala Marquetry, Artax...)...but Wagon Limit was a clunkup type horse. If a breeder wants to use Wagon Limit's damside as a stamina influence, he's still got the stereotype as a CC line sire (speed influenced). Isn't he one of those sires that's caught in the crossfire between what his breeding says and what his running style was?
He could win at a mile, but only at the Grade III level...and he made 39 career starts. 39 starts? Who wants that from a sire nowadays? YUCK!!!
Maven, what do you think: When anyone thinks of CC or his line, they think speed (ala Marquetry, Artax...)...but Wagon Limit was a clunkup type horse. If a breeder wants to use Wagon Limit's damside as a stamina influence, he's still got the stereotype as a CC line sire (speed influenced). Isn't he one of those sires that's caught in the crossfire between what his breeding says and what his running style was?
He could win at a mile, but only at the Grade III level...and he made 39 career starts. 39 starts? Who wants that from a sire nowadays? YUCK!!!
What synthetics are to California racing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU
I would agree that he's more of a source of stamina rather than pure speed, where Marquetry is one of the most pure (and underrated) speed sources in North America.
When you look at Marquetry's pedigree, I think most assumptions would have thought 9f type, but as we know, he's all speed.
I think it's a really good showing of how versatile Conquistador Cielo is. Im actually might be claiming a Conquistador Cielo filly off the track. I tend to stay away from claimers, but I like how he works with the majority of commercial stallions.
When you look at Marquetry's pedigree, I think most assumptions would have thought 9f type, but as we know, he's all speed.
I think it's a really good showing of how versatile Conquistador Cielo is. Im actually might be claiming a Conquistador Cielo filly off the track. I tend to stay away from claimers, but I like how he works with the majority of commercial stallions.
Don't be so humble - you are not that great.
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Rokeby Forever
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Rokeby Forever
- Darley line
- Posts: 6684
- Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:52 pm
- Location: Reno, NV
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Rokeby Forever
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- Posts: 6684
- Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:52 pm
- Location: Reno, NV
jk!-
Rokeby Forever
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Re: Wagon Limit again
Derby2004 wrote:I know this has been discussed previously, but I cannot figure out why Wagon Limit is NOT commercial and why he only bred 15 mares last year. I mean he had Silver Wagon and his brother who are still racing and winning G1 events. He seems to be a nice looking stallion with great numbers. So why would mares not be going to him? Same with Intidab. Both can get a big horse fairly easily. I have not seen either ones babies, so Im assuming they arent as good looking as others.
I've got WL as the "best value" in America BY FAR at $2,500. He's a much better sire then many standing for 10 and even 20 times more. He's not 'commercial" but so what that's a scam anyway that has been found out in recent time(see: Jess Jackson/Mattress Mac/Satash Sanan versus scrupulous bloodstock agents and trainers). Anyone notice the SIGNIFICANT drop off in prices as a result? I'm sure those involved did.
WL was a solid race horse running 20 times winning 6 with 4 seconds and one third including wins in the GI Jockey Club Gold Cup by 5 1/2 over Gentlemen and Skip Away and WL also ran the fastest mile for the year when he won the Westchester.
His AEI/CI and Ave. earnings per start/starter and median are "off the charts". He is one of the few bargains at stud today and I've recommended him to anyone looking to raise a nice horse with a chance to get the "big horse".