I have a 4 year old gelding that has ran two times and both times ran last. The first time he ran we figured out that he couldn't breathe and we ran him back next time with a tongue tie and he again, ran last. He runs to the 3/8 pole and just stops. He ran on Lasix his second start..no bleeding.
We had the horse scoped and the vet said his epiglottis is longer than it should be and he is entrapping himself. She said there are many different things you can do for it besides surgery (we really don't want to take that route).
We gave him 30 days at the farm where he was equicised and he has been training since. He had his first breeze today and was wearing a spoon bit and his tongue was tied. He did the same thing, stopped at the 3/8 pole. The rider cam back and said he cant breathe.
Any Suggestions?
Would tieing his tongue outside his mouth help? I have heard a cornell collar may work, but wanted opinions on it before getting one. Thoughts on this would be appreciated!
Entrapped Epiglottis
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AfleetAlex
- Weanling
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Entrapped Epiglottis
And BEGONE is GONE!
Re: Entrapped Epiglottis
AfleetAlex wrote:I have a 4 year old gelding that has ran two times and both times ran last. The first time he ran we figured out that he couldn't breathe and we ran him back next time with a tongue tie and he again, ran last. He runs to the 3/8 pole and just stops. He ran on Lasix his second start..no bleeding.
We had the horse scoped and the vet said his epiglottis is longer than it should be and he is entrapping himself. She said there are many different things you can do for it besides surgery (we really don't want to take that route).
We gave him 30 days at the farm where he was equicised and he has been training since. He had his first breeze today and was wearing a spoon bit and his tongue was tied. He did the same thing, stopped at the 3/8 pole. The rider cam back and said he cant breathe.
Any Suggestions?
Would tieing his tongue outside his mouth help? I have heard a cornell collar may work, but wanted opinions on it before getting one. Thoughts on this would be appreciated!
Tying a for sale sign on his stall door would probably work best. The surgery is your only route - but no guarantee he can run if he can breathe.
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Tucumcari
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Tongue tie figure eight or flash? I don't like the tounge depresser bit. it's too much in their mouths. IMO. Simple to me is better
You gave him 30 days and exercised on the equi ciser.. how long did you jog gallop before working and if stopping at the three eights how far did you work for your first work back after time off with a reason?
Why not back right up in the horse and work 3/8 from the 1/4 pole. Tell the rider don't ask, don't take a choke hold. Work on his own, get him/her comfortable and breathing. And by working to the 7/8 pole and past the wire the rider has the option of working only a quarter in the event that he/she feels or hears breathing change. Do that several times.25. 38. no gallop out. If the horse pulls up gurgling next week don't extend it further. Gradually build. Don't make it a frantic pull to the poll, send away from the poll, and have nothing left at the 3/8.
Sometimes young or not perfectly fit horses will displace as a result of being soft and fat inside.
Use some clenbuterol, open the airways. Not a high dose. 3cc will do to start if the horse is not a bleeder. get the horse to relax. be confident, and know that it CAN finish without struggling or becoming "frantic"
Surgery is an option. But it's not a be all, end all fix it. Surgeries are limited in their usefulness, and more often than not do need to be done more than once. BUT you can usually get a couple decent races out of it if you take your time and still develop the horse along slowly. Don't just make your first work 5/8 because you want to run in 2 weeks. Sometimes you have to back up to the abc's.
You gave him 30 days and exercised on the equi ciser.. how long did you jog gallop before working and if stopping at the three eights how far did you work for your first work back after time off with a reason?
Why not back right up in the horse and work 3/8 from the 1/4 pole. Tell the rider don't ask, don't take a choke hold. Work on his own, get him/her comfortable and breathing. And by working to the 7/8 pole and past the wire the rider has the option of working only a quarter in the event that he/she feels or hears breathing change. Do that several times.25. 38. no gallop out. If the horse pulls up gurgling next week don't extend it further. Gradually build. Don't make it a frantic pull to the poll, send away from the poll, and have nothing left at the 3/8.
Sometimes young or not perfectly fit horses will displace as a result of being soft and fat inside.
Use some clenbuterol, open the airways. Not a high dose. 3cc will do to start if the horse is not a bleeder. get the horse to relax. be confident, and know that it CAN finish without struggling or becoming "frantic"
Surgery is an option. But it's not a be all, end all fix it. Surgeries are limited in their usefulness, and more often than not do need to be done more than once. BUT you can usually get a couple decent races out of it if you take your time and still develop the horse along slowly. Don't just make your first work 5/8 because you want to run in 2 weeks. Sometimes you have to back up to the abc's.
Proverbs 31:8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
Found this article explaining the surgical options...
http://www.ctba.com/99magazine/sep99/sept4.htm
http://www.ctba.com/99magazine/sep99/sept4.htm
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"Don't be a boorish buffoon" -Hokies Respect 'Jerk Alert'
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KamiBrooks
- Starters Handicap
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soundfast wrote:Laurierace has a used Cornell collar for sale on ebay. It is listed under buying/selling category. She could tell you how well it works and maybe you could buy hers and spend less than half the retail on it.
Cornell collar is for flipping pallete... I doubt it will do anything for an entrapped epiglottis.
Watch what you do with that, I had a horse w/entrapped epiglottis (that must have stayed trapped). By the time I got him, it had caused an ulceration and infection in his vocal cord (cartlidge) that had to be removed with surgery (no options). And they fixed the epiglottis while they were in there.
You need to look at a scope or google up some pictures to understand what he's dealing with. Personally, I think you could probably tie his tounge to his saddle and do no good for the epiglottis...
Its find to try to look for alternatives, but you really need to monitor it with scope if you don't want to end up removing his flapper for infection.
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ratherrapid
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my approach would closely resemble tucs with a few variations.
first, i'd decide riderless whether this is a fitness problem or a breathing problem. if you gallop the horse in the paddock to it's level of fitness and hear nothing and believe the horse is breathing freely, then i'd go on with training. if there are sounds or obstructed breathing you do surgery or quit. it would be cruel to go on, and if there's surgery you'd have to test the success.
As Tuc noted, when you're on the horse having an unfit horse lock up on its breathing is very common. if there is no breathing problem and you have logical progressive training your rider should be reporting that the breathing lock up happens further and further down the track. reports the horse goes 5f at racing speed without the breathing locking up you're close to a race. as Tuc noted there are various things you can do to aid (if there is no breathing obstruction.).
first, i'd decide riderless whether this is a fitness problem or a breathing problem. if you gallop the horse in the paddock to it's level of fitness and hear nothing and believe the horse is breathing freely, then i'd go on with training. if there are sounds or obstructed breathing you do surgery or quit. it would be cruel to go on, and if there's surgery you'd have to test the success.
As Tuc noted, when you're on the horse having an unfit horse lock up on its breathing is very common. if there is no breathing problem and you have logical progressive training your rider should be reporting that the breathing lock up happens further and further down the track. reports the horse goes 5f at racing speed without the breathing locking up you're close to a race. as Tuc noted there are various things you can do to aid (if there is no breathing obstruction.).