Louis's Blog on Inbreeding

Understanding pedigrees, inbreeding, dosage, etc.

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louis finochio
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Postby louis finochio » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:28 pm

EINSTEIN (BRZ) dkb/br. H, 2002 DP = 9-7-12-0-2 (30) DI = 2.75 CD = 0.70 - 24 Starts, 10 Wins, 3 Places, 2 Shows Career Earnings: $2,278,020

Owner: Midnight Cry Stable/Patricia Cunningham and Melissa Green, Lessee
Breeder: Fazenda Mondesir
Winnings: 24 Starts: 10 - 3 - 2, $2,278,020

At 4:
Won Gulfstream Park Breeders' Cup H. (G1,11.5fT)
At 5:
Won Mervyn Muniz Jr. Memorial H. (G2,9fT)
3rd Gulfstream Park Breeders'Cup H. (G1,11fT)

At 6:
Won Gulfstream Park Turf S. (G1,11FT), Woodford Reserve Turf Classic S. (G1,8.5FT), Clark H. (G2,9F)
2nd Maker's Mark Mile (G1,8FT), Stephen Foster H. (G1,9F), Firecracker H. (G2T)

At 7:
Won Santa Anita H. (G1,SA,10F)
3rd Donn H. (G1,9F)

Foaled October 23, 2002.

EINSTEIN br. H. 2002
Spend a Buck---Gay Charm, by Ghadeer

Einstein is a Non-Fashion Bred with 24 crosses NP--8 crosses Ph. thru his sires & dams.
E has an outcross pedigree with no duplication of inbreeding, that is an example of a mating that is bred for soundness.
E is a 7 yr. old that inherited his soundness thru his outcross pedigree. Congrats to his breeder for avoiding the temptation of those matings of Fashion.
Those without sin cast the first stone.
Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:55 am

PASIONARIA F, 2004 DP = 6-1-7-2-0 (16) DI = 1.91 CD = 0.69 Career Earnings: $10205


foaled 02/15/2004
won 10/29/2006 El Comandante, mdn clmg, $5,070, 6 f, 1:14.38.
5/5/07: $5K clm race 4 Camerero, broke down stretch.

PASIONARIA f. 2004
Be Frank---Too Many Secrets, by Yallah Prince

Pasionaira was a Fashion Bred that started twice & had 10 crosses Ph. Pasionaria was inbred 4 X 4 X 5 X 5 ND, Nearco branch Ph.---4 X 4 Nijinsky, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Natalma, Polynesian branch Ph.---5 X 5 Nearctic, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Somethingroyal mare outcross, Princequillo branch Prince Rose.
P had 1 cross each Nashua, Bold Ruler, Secretariat, StormCat, Mr. P. RAN, Native Dancer, all these stallions descend from the sire line of Ph.

There is a prolific number of inbred inividuals in this high risk mating for unsoundness, as the Ph. domination is evident here to produce a tb with low bone density.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Tue Mar 10, 2009 6:27 am

QUALITY ROAD (USA) b. C, 2006 DP = 7-3-11-1-0 (22) DI = 2.38 CD = 0.73 - 3 Starts, 2 Wins, 1 Places, 0 Shows Career Earnings: $182,830

Owner: Edward P. Evans
Breeder: Edward P. Evans
State Bred: VA
Winnings: 3 Starts: 2 - 1 - 0, $182,830

At 3: Won Fountain of Youth (G2)

Foaled March 23, 2006

QUALITY ROAD b. C. 2006
Elusive Quality---Kobla, by Strawberry Road

QR is a Fashion Bred as he is inbred 4 X 4 RAN, Polynesian branch Ph.---5 X 5 Native Dancer, Polynesian branch Ph.---4 X 5 ND, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Bold Ruler, Nearco branch Ph.
QR has 18 crosses NP---14 crosses PH. thru his sires & dams.
No Fashion-Bred has ever won the Derby, could QR become the 1st to turn the tide ?
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:57 am

NORTHERN DANCER (CAN) b. H, 1961 DP = 8-16-15-3-0 (42) DI = 3.00 CD = 0.69 - 18 Starts, 14 Wins, 2 Places, 2 Shows Career Earnings: $580,806

Owner: Windfields Farm (E. P. Taylor)
Breeder: E. P. Taylor
State Bred: ON
Winnings: 18 Starts: 14 - 2 - 2, $580,806

Remsen S., Coronation Futurity, Summer S., Carleton S., Kentucky Derby (NTR), Preakness S., Flamingo S., Florida Derby, Queen's Plate, Blue Grass S.

Foaled May 27, 1961.
1964 Champion Three Year Old Colt in the USA & Canada, Canadian Horse of the Year.
At 3: ETR Gulfstream Park, 7f in 1:22.2; NTR Churchill Downs, 10f in 2:00.0.
Leading sire in the USA, 1971 & 1977; in Great Britain, 1970, 1977, 1983, & 1984.
Leading broodmare sire, 1991.
Over $31 million in progeny earnings.

Pensioned from stud in 1987.
Died November 16, 1990. Buried at Windfields Farm, Ontario.

NORTHERN DANCER b. H. 1961--1990
Nearctic---Natalma, by Native Dancer

ND was inbred 4 X 5 Gainsborough---5 X 5 Chaucer
ND soundest progeny were: Black Powder 118 starts, 12 crosses NP---4 crosses Ph.---Dance Despoir 84 starts, 14 crosses NP---2 Ph.---Broken Penny 79 starts, 14 crosses NP---2 crosses Ph.

Why has ND been responsible for the most injuries & breakdowns thru inbreeding when his progeny were so sound?
The answer is, when ND was standing stud in the 70s & 80s , those NP sire lines were alive & well, which gave ND progeny many NP outcross sire lines to produce a prolific number of sound individuals.
Today our breed is 95 % Ph. & 5 % NP, as we have lost those NP sire lines that ND was bred to.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Thu Mar 12, 2009 6:32 am

LACEWELL (USA) b. G, 2003 DP = 12-3-21-0-0 (36) DI = 2.43 CD = 0.75 - 17 Starts, 10 Wins, 3 Places, 1 Shows Career Earnings: $285,647

Owner: The Elkstone Group LLC
Breeder: Hopewell Investments L.L.C.
State Bred: KY
Winnings: 17 Starts: 10 - 3 - 1, $285,647

At 5: 2nd Charles Town Dash H(CT,4.5F);Won West Virginia Chairman Cup(Mnr,4.5F); 1st HBPA Bolivar Harpers Ferry and Shepherdstown Mayors S.; 2nd Potomac H

Foaled April 2003 Stakes Winner

LACEWELL b. G. 2003
Souvenir Copy---Aerlal Meeting, by General Meeting

Lacewel broke down near finish, & had 10 crosses Ph.
L was a Fashion Bred & was inbred 5 X 5 Nearctic,Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Natalma, Polynesian branch Ph.---3 X 5 RAN, Polynesian branch Ph.---4 X 4 ND, Nearco branch Ph.---3 X 3 Nureyev, Nearco branch Ph.
L had 1 cross each Mr. P.---Nashua---Secretariat---Bold Ruler---Hail to Reason---Nasrullah.
All of Lacewell's inbreeding & 1 cross of each Ph. foundation stallions created a high risk mating, that resulted in a career ending injury.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby Bunty Lawless » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:14 pm

louis finochio wrote:If i were a tb breeder & my name appeared as the breeder of these tbs that sustained a career ending injury, i would go back to the pedigree of the mare & stallion that produced the tb that was injured, & i would see where i bred too close. I would use an outcross mare to breed a sound individual.



And I have a friend with total outcross mares, with decent race records, bloodlines and starts exceeding 20 each. Bred to solid horses, but still the training methods compromised the offspring's careers.

Impatience, ignorant trainers and mostly greed breaks these horses down. I've been observing for over 5 years, up close and personal. It is definitely the trainers (including the extensive use of vets) and the inconsistent surfaces. BTW, I include starting horses too early, before they are mature or before they have enough of a foundation under them as a trainer's decision.

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Postby louis finochio » Thu Mar 12, 2009 5:28 pm

Those Fashion Breds will have no chance to survive with those trainers u posted. Those Non-Fashion breds will average more lifetime starts, with those same fly by night trainers, as their bone density reading is way above those Fashion Breds.

Before a buyer bids on his tb at the sales, he should go that extra mile & have a bone density test done on that tb. In todays market u have to out fox the fox.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Thu Mar 12, 2009 5:42 pm

u gave me an idea of listing the trainers name, of these tbs that sustained career ending injuries & breakdowns.

When i researched those rescue farms, most all those tbs were Non-Fashion Breds & had 30 starts +. Those Fashion breds were not at those rescue centers, as they became injured early in their career.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby Bunty Lawless » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:13 pm

louis finochio wrote:EINSTEIN (BRZ) dkb/br. H, 2002 DP = 9-7-12-0-2 (30) DI = 2.75 CD = 0.70 - 24 Starts, 10 Wins, 3 Places, 2 Shows Career Earnings: $2,278,020

Owner: Midnight Cry Stable/Patricia Cunningham and Melissa Green, EINSTEIN br. H. 2002
Spend a Buck---Gay Charm, by Ghadeer

Einstein is a Non-Fashion Bred with 24 crosses NP--8 crosses Ph. thru his sires & dams.
E has an outcross pedigree with no duplication of inbreeding, that is an example of a mating that is bred for soundness.
E is a 7 yr. old that inherited his soundness thru his outcross pedigree. Congrats to his breeder for avoiding the temptation of those matings of Fashion.


Do you suppose his success and soundness had anything to do with the potent nick of Buckpasser sireline to Lyphard broodmare sireline?

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Postby louis finochio » Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:37 am

VINSTAR (USA) C, 2005 DP = 5-10-13-4-0 (32) DI = 2.05 CD = 0.50 - 3 Starts, M Wins, 0 Places, 0 Shows Career Earnings: $2,945

Owner: Stonestreet Stables, LLC
Breeder: Summer Wind Farm
State Bred: KY
Winnings: 3 Starts: M - 0 - 0, $2,945

Updated 5-29-08
KEESEP06: $700K
Euthanized after suffering fractures of both front sesamoids and dislocated right front fetlock in first race (6f $50K mdn clm) at Churchill Downs on 6/21/08. RIP.

VINSTAR C. 2005
Vindication---Fashion Star, by Chiefs Crown

V was trained by Steve Asmussen & was a Fashion Bred with 10 crosses Ph. thru his sires.
V was inbred 4 X 5 Hail to Reason, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Bold Ruler, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Turn-to, Nearco branch Ph.---5 X 5 Somethingroyal mare, Princequillo branch Prince Rose outcross.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Fri Mar 13, 2009 7:02 am

Einstein has a prolific number of those NP sire line stallions of staminain his immediate family. Those stallions of stamina are: War Admiral, Swaps, Prince bio, Princequillo, Tornodo, Battlefield, Tanerko, Rialto, Chamossaire, Supreme Court.

Lyphard has the Full brothers Pharos & Fairway in his 4th generation, Bold Ruler returns the same blood of Pharos in his 3rd generation, this is a big plus to breed a quality tb.

The Lyphard Bold Ruler cross is a positive to breed into bloodline affinity. Better to breed into what works than not, as those positive nicks tell us which way to breed.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:28 am

Lets see how the various branches of Nearco play their part in those foundation stallions inbreeding thru those Fashion Breds.

Nashua by Nasrullah, by Nearco by Pharos, by Ph.

Turn-to by Royal Charger, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Hail to Reason by Turn-to, by Royal Charger, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Secretariat by Bold Ruler, by Nasrullah by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Northern Dancer by Nearctic, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Nasrullah by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Nearctic by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Bold Ruler by Nasrullah, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Next the Polynesian branch of Ph.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby siegy » Sat Mar 14, 2009 12:24 pm

louis finochio wrote:Lets see how the various branches of Nearco play their part in those foundation stallions inbreeding thru those Fashion Breds.

Nashua by Nasrullah, by Nearco by Pharos, by Ph.

Turn-to by Royal Charger, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Hail to Reason by Turn-to, by Royal Charger, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Secretariat by Bold Ruler, by Nasrullah by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Northern Dancer by Nearctic, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Nasrullah by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Nearctic by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Bold Ruler by Nasrullah, by Nearco, by Pharos, by Ph.

Next the Polynesian branch of Ph.


Hi Louis,

Like EINSTEIN, (bend in the river) very much.

Now what You say about SICKLE and PHARAMOND?

Awaiting Your reply,


Thank You,

Siegy,
:idea:
Flora is beginning of biology, chemistry is master.

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Postby louis finochio » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:12 pm

Lets see how those branches of Polynesian or Sickle play their part in those foundation stallions & mare Natalma thru their inbreeding in those Fashion matings.

NATIVE DANCER by Polynesian, by Unbreakable, by Sickle, by Ph.

RAISE A NATIVE by Native Dancer, by Polynesian, by Unbreakable, by Sickle, by Ph.

MR. PROSPECTOR by Raise a Native, by Native Dancer, by Polynesian, by Unbreakable, by Sickle, by Ph.

NATALMA mare by Native Dancer, by Polynesian by Unbreakable, by Sickle, by Ph.

Next Pharamond branch of Ph.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio

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Postby louis finochio » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:38 am

Lets see how those 2 branches of Pharamond play their part in those foundation stallions thru their inbreeding in those Fashion Matings.

TOM FOOL by Menow, by Pharamond by Ph.

BUCKPASSER by Tom Fool, by Menow, by Pharamond, by Ph.
Those without sin cast the first stone.

Louis Finochio