Lawyer Ron...WOW!

[horsenuts]

You may recall that Forego bumped the rail in the KY Derby, which probably cost him more than the 1/2 length he missed third by. Nobody was going to beat Secretariat that day, or any Derby winner before or after would have beaten him that day. I'm not sure why people would remember Twice A Prince better than Forego - Twice A Prince was 2nd in the Belmont Stakes, but Forego later beat him in the Discovery Handicap that year.

If you ask me, I'd say that racing Magna Graduate in Grade Is this year has been mismanagement...he's a Grade II horse and would have banked much more this year if Pletcher kept him in Grade IIs. He got dusted in the Donn against Invasor, and he was beaten by Flashy Bull in the Stephen Foster, but that was Flashy Bull's first Grade I....he couldn't even win that. If Pletcher knew that Lawyer Ron was coming up to a career effort, it was stupid to run Magna Graduate in the race, don't you think? Why not just wait for a $300,000 Grade II to come up for him?

MG has made over $2.2 MILLION with a lifetime record of 9 wins / 4 seconds and 4 thirds from 25 starts. This is "mismanagement"? Is there no end to your absurdity?

[Rokeby Forever]

He could be over $3 Million with better management. He earned nothing in the Donn and nothing in the Whitney...two missed opportunities not racing in Grade II races.

[horsenuts]

He could be over $3 Million with better management. He earned nothing in the Donn and nothing in the Whitney...two missed opportunities racing in Grade II races.

Excuse me.... BUT MG just ran second in the GI SF beaten a short head. Let me also state that owners of these type horses wish only to race in GIs whenever possible. Also, MG was one of the race time favorites for the Whitney and deservedly so. Obviously, LR relished 'Toga and took to it like a duck to water. MG appeared to be the opposite and never really took to the track. My suggestion would be to find a GI at another track perhaps even the Pacific Classic and I'm assuming that's exactly what they are doing.

[Rokeby Forever]

So, you'd bring back Magna Graduate in three weeks to try that new, deep Del Mar Polytrack surface at 1 1/4 mile against California's best when MG has never won beyond 1 1/8th mile, even on a surface that he's proved that he likes? If you thought Magna Graduate belonged in the Whitney, why wouldn't you race him back in the Woodward with five weeks rest instead? Because he doesn't like Saratoga? Wouldn't he have given an indication of that in the mornings before the Whitney? Or, nobody cared even if he did - he didn't handle the track is what you wrote. If that's the case, someone's asleep at the wheel.

Magna Graduate clearly likes Churchill - his Clark win is the biggest win of his career. So, on a surface he likes, he couldn't beat Flashy Bull at 1 1/4 in the Stephen Foster, a horse that had never won anything other than a Grade III before that race. That doesn't tell you that Magna Graduate isn't a Grade 1 horse, especially at 1 1/4 mile? What does it tell you...that if a field comes up really crappy, Magna Graduate might beat it at 1 1/4 mile?

[Sysonby]

I'm not sure if it's Pletcher and Velazquez (as opposed to Holthus and McKee) or simple maturity but this is a different Lawyer Ron. Remember how he never seemed to settle and it didn't look like McKee had enough strength to hold him in the runup to the Derby? This used to be a bit of a one dimensional horse that used his formidable raw talent to wing on the front end. The horse I watched yesterday was an infinitely more professional racer. He also may have just signaled that Lawyer Ron has arrived.

[zinn21]

I believe LR chipped a knee, had surgery and came back last fall. A legitimate reason his form was inconsistent late last year.

LR is a top knotch racehorse. He ran a tremendous race in the Whitney and beat a field of very good horses. I would think he is the present leader in his division and the current favorite for the Classic.

[Toccet02]

I just heard from a co worker that Lawyer Ron's time is being investigated. He may NOT have gone that fast.
I thought it looked wrong, myself. Fairly ordinary mile, so the last fraction should have looked blazing. But it didn't to me.
Rumor? Truth?
Time will tell.

[bdw0617]

Rok hit the nail on the head with MG. He is not a grade 1 horse, and T Pletch, if he knew Lawyer Ron was sitting on that type of race, should have picked an easier (i.e winnable) spot to run in. I can see why he ran in the Stephen Foster, but still. That's like SA running Zanjero and he knows Curlin is going to give his best effort.. he is wasting a horses prime effort that he know he can't win.

And you are SO right about the breeding aspect of all this. If LR was an AP Indy or Storm Cat the racing world / breeding world would be all "gaw gaw" over his performance much the way they sing the praises of After Market based on the fact he's a Storm Cat. Pitiful how they do this and it's done all the time.

although I like the breeding aspect (Rahy Damsire) I'm not that high on After Market..when he steps out the confines of So Cal and beats someone... I will give him his due. But I don't think he was better than Lava Man in the CW.. C Nok made the worst move I have seen him make in years and only lost a length...the horse I want to see him go up against when it's all said and done.

[horsenuts]

Rok hit the nail on the head with MG. He is not a grade 1 horse, and T Pletch, if he knew Lawyer Ron was sitting on that type of race, should have picked an easier (i.e winnable) spot to run in. I can see why he ran in the Stephen Foster, but still. That's like SA running Zanjero and he knows Curlin is going to give his best effort.. he is wasting a horses prime effort that he know he can't win.

And you are SO right about the breeding aspect of all this. If LR was an AP Indy or Storm Cat the racing world / breeding world would be all "gaw gaw" over his performance much the way they sing the praises of After Market based on the fact he's a Storm Cat. Pitiful how they do this and it's done all the time.

although I like the breeding aspect (Rahy Damsire) I'm not that high on After Market..when he steps out the confines of So Cal and beats someone... I will give him his due. But I don't think he was better than Lava Man in the CW.. C Nok made the worst move I have seen him make in years and only lost a length...the horse I want to see him go up against when it's all said and done.

Excuse me... but who was the race time favorite for the Whitney? And who was just beaten less then a head in the GI Stephen Foster? Hint: His initials are MG. Now, just what type of race should such a horse run in that has made over $2.2 MILLION dollars? Honestly you guys get more ridiculous everytime one reads your latest posts.


MG is and was as much a GI horse as any other that was entered in the Whitney... and why HE WAS THE RACE TIME FAVORITE!

[Rokeby Forever]

And he ran so well, Horsenuts.

The horse that beat Magna Graduate by a head in the SF was nothing but a Grade III winner. You have a good sense of humor, Horsenuts. LOL!

[Sam]

actually, I have told you in a previous post, I was raised in France so French is actually my native tounge since you were trying to sarcastic.

Actually, no, I don't remember you saying you were raised in France. I do remember you excusing the last badly written post with "I've been up all night." You may have posted it, but I don't read every single post made to this board... I'd spend 5x as much time here if I did.

However, yes I was being sarcastic, but I was also giving you the benefit of the doubt which is why I did ask about your native language instead of immediately hammering you for the poorly constructed post. That being said, I'm on a couple of boards where the make up is about half English speakers and half Brasilian or German (depending on the board) and just about all of them are more than capable of typing up a coherent, properly spelled, properly punctuated post... so "forgive, my English is not good" doesn't really hold in my opinion.

[Rokeby Forever]

SAM is more forgiving of Presidents that claim not to know the definition of the word, "Is."

[horsenuts]

And he ran so well, Horsenuts.

The horse that beat Magna Graduate by a head in the SF was nothing but a Grade III winner. You have a good sense of humor, Horsenuts. LOL!

Wrong again Rokeby(what else is new?). Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner! He won the Stephen Foster. You must have FB confused with those Phipps stable horses you drone on about... horses who continually struggle in ALL Graded events. Again, Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner.... and MG was second in said race beaten a mere head.


A Grade I winner is a Grade I winner whether Rokeby deems them worthy or not(not that anyone cares). The same way many a mediocre team has won the Super Bowl down through the decades not all SB winners are going to be as good as the '85 bears... '88 49ers or '92/93 Cowboys. But they are ALL SB winners nonetheless. Greatness aside a SB winner is a SB winner. The same way FB is a Grade I winner and MG placed second in said event.

[Rokeby Forever]

And he ran so well, Horsenuts.

The horse that beat Magna Graduate by a head in the SF was nothing but a Grade III winner. You have a good sense of humor, Horsenuts. LOL!

Wrong again Rokeby(what else is new?). Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner! He won the Stephen Foster. You must have FB confused with those Phipps stable horses you drone on about... horses who continually struggle in ALL Graded events. Again, Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner.... and MG was second in said race beaten a mere head.


A Grade I winner is a Grade I winner whether Rokeby deems them worthy or not(not that anyone cares). The same way many a mediocre team has won the Super Bowl down through the decades not all SB winners are going to be as good as the '85 bears... '88 49ers or '92/93 Cowboys. But they are ALL SB winners nonetheless. Greatness aside a SB winner is a SB winner. The same way FB is a Grade I winner and MG placed second in said event.

Coming into the SF, Flashy Bull was a Grade III winner. It was because MG couldn't beat a Grade III winner that Flashy Bull is now Grade I. DUH!!!

Oh, and Flashy Bull ran real well, as well. I guess Grade III is Grade III.

On your Super Bowl list, how could you leave off the Packers and the Steelers? Either of those two teams would have buried the Bears, 49ers, or Cowboys.

[horsenuts]

And he ran so well, Horsenuts.

The horse that beat Magna Graduate by a head in the SF was nothing but a Grade III winner. You have a good sense of humor, Horsenuts. LOL!

Wrong again Rokeby(what else is new?). Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner! He won the Stephen Foster. You must have FB confused with those Phipps stable horses you drone on about... horses who continually struggle in ALL Graded events. Again, Flashy Bull IS a Grade I winner.... and MG was second in said race beaten a mere head.


A Grade I winner is a Grade I winner whether Rokeby deems them worthy or not(not that anyone cares). The same way many a mediocre team has won the Super Bowl down through the decades not all SB winners are going to be as good as the '85 bears... '88 49ers or '92/93 Cowboys. But they are ALL SB winners nonetheless. Greatness aside a SB winner is a SB winner. The same way FB is a Grade I winner and MG placed second in said event.

Coming into the SF, Flashy Bull was a Grade III winner. It was because MG couldn't beat a Grade III winner that Flashy Bull is now Grade I. DUH!!!

Oh, and Flashy Bull ran real well, as well. I guess Grade III is Grade III.

On your Super Bowl list, how could you leave off the Packers and the Steelers? Either of those two teams would have buried the Bears, 49ers, or Cowboys.

My point is not all horses that win Grade Is are great horses.... in fact MOST aren't... BUT they are Grade I winners nonetheless. The same analogy applies to many Super Bowl winners.... few are great teams but they are ALL SB winners regardless of said greatness... or lack thereof.



And it's also true Grade Is are really watered down with many simply being regional stake races but you'll have to take that up with the JC / Graded Stakes Committee and Breeding industry. I've harped on this for years to no avail.