Keep Keeneland's entire yearling sale in September? Opinion?

Rokeby Forever · Postby **Rokeby Forever** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:49 pm

The reason for moving the sale to September seems to have subsided, but the dates are being kept.

I haven't seen anyone's opinion on keeping the dates in September, or if the dates should be moved back to when they were - either pro or con. I think there's a good argument on both sides, but what do you think and why?

Maven · Postby **Maven** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:51 pm

I'd prefer a July and a September sale.

The September sale is such a circus and can be very overwhelming. There's also a lot of junk they allow in it because it's suppose to be this "all encompassing" sale.

I think in reality, the size is going to shoot them in the foot.

winds · Postby **winds** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 5:37 pm

Maven,

I agree with you. I watched the sale from my computer. Now I'll be the first to say, I really couldn't see much in the way of conformation. But I saw a lot of nice yearlings in Book 3 and 4 go a little cheaper than the pedigree indicated, some real cheap. I'd look at my partner Vicki and would ask if there legs were on backwards or something. She kept saying, there are to many horses in this sale. They have to many horses to choose from.

I'd have to say I agree with her. Do you think that is the problem?

Maybe have book 1 and 2 the July sale like it used to be?

winds

LB · Postby LB » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:49 pm

The reason the July sale went away is because not enough people wanted to enter their horses in it. Most preferred to give their yearlings an extra couple of months to mature. Since the consignors with the top yearlings (those that would have been pointed toward the July sale) now find themselves happily in September, and since there seems to be as much money around in Sept. as there once was in July, how do you propose to force them to go back?

Maven · Postby **Maven** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:23 pm

I don't think the July sale HAS to be the premiere yearling sale it use to be. Why not make it more a pinhook/moderately priced sale much like the FT counterpart. The FT July sale is known for producing racehorses.

I think having a Keeneland July sale aimed at those horses who would be in book 4,5, & 6 in the Sept sale would be a great fit. Many of them might become a big fish in a small pond.

yukidragon · Postby **yukidragon** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:54 pm

Sounds like a plann to me,lets drive out the smaller breeders by making them show smaller animals early in July.
Sure wouldn't want the poor breeders to have a edge up on the market would we...

Rokeby Forever · Postby **Rokeby Forever** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:58 pm

I have to agree with Maven on this one. I'd also like to Keeneland do what F-T did with the new sires - sell their foals in a separate session or sessions of the sale to help the market get a good handle on what the new sires offer. That's the general pinhooker part of the sale, and I think sales companies should accomodate segments of the industry accordingly.

Plus, Keeneland now is just too long. Poor Maven had to clunk around the barns in her spike heels for two straight weeks.

PS: Yuki - it also gives the "small breeder" two months less for something to go wrong.

Green Hills · Postby **Green Hills** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 8:16 pm

Personally I like September...July is just too busy for me. And this is strictly from my point of view and my schedule. September is ideal. They've grown a bit more (not necessarily bigger, just, hopefully, better) and as I said the timing for me and for our way of operating is great. I'm sure there are others who like to see them closer to when they will be going to the trainers. For us, we'd have to lay them up at least 3 months before they'd go...since we never send them before October/November. Actually I'd even rather see it in October...well not really...I'm at Congress then and I'd have to give that up...well...maybe later in September than it is....Later in my view is better than earlier.

Maven · Postby **Maven** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:56 am

yukidragon wrote:Sounds like a plann to me,lets drive out the smaller breeders by making them show smaller animals early in July.
Sure wouldn't want the poor breeders to have a edge up on the market would we...

MANY of the yearlings look GREAT in July... I find it funny so many people bitch about the size and mass of so many of the September sale offerings but would find it a negative to sell in July.

There's nothing wrong with a smaller option for breeders while still welcoming the same core buyers at a sale.

yukidragon · Postby **yukidragon** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:12 am

I find the rich breeders are looking at their wallet not the industry as a whole.
If you feel that way,about people bitching bigger horses then you might say books 1,2,3 could sell in July eh?
Let the little man grow a bigger horse.
The price may balance out in some cases.
Which is why you leaning towards putting the smaller cheap horses in July.

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:15 am

I thought the primary reason for cancelling the July sale was the small crop due to MRLS.

I would vote heavily in favor of resurrecting the July sale. The September sale has just grown much too large and unwieldy.

Maven · Postby **Maven** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:23 am

yukidragon wrote:I find the rich breeders are looking at their wallet not the industry as a whole.
If you feel that way,about people bitching bigger horses then you might say books 1,2,3 could sell in July eh?
Let the little man grow a bigger horse.
The price may balance out in some cases.
Which is why you leaning towards putting the smaller cheap horses in July.

If you think smaller breeders aren't looking out for their wallets too, you haven't been talking to many. In fact, the vast majority breed mares that have no business reproducing because they THINK they can make money off of them.

FT July is far from a "cheap" sale with "cheap" horses. It's just more of a racehorse type sale, instead of a beauty pageant with top tier pedigrees.

There's no reason to think the Keeneland July sale cant be the same thing.

And you know what, if there's a precocious foal who would be in the top 2 books of Sept, why wouldn't they drop it in July? Big fish/small pond principle.

Maven · Postby **Maven** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:32 am

It's also worth mentioning that it's easier for a "smaller breeder" to make a profit when they're not one of two thousand like horses.

ratherrapid · Postby **ratherrapid** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:17 pm

from a buyer's point of view the more the merrier. 2 sales=waste of resources and time?

Rokeby Forever · Postby **Rokeby Forever** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 12:37 am

It's a buyer's market no matter if it's one sale or two - when stallions have 130, 140, 150 foals or more in a crop, it takes a standout individual to sell well - the rest are faces in the crowd. Also, if a young sire doesn't get off to a fast start, the market cools on it like the plague. Look how quickly the market cooled off on Sky Mesa from 2006. Empire Maker, too. Came Home has only two crops to race and he's already an inmate in a leper colony.