It's crunch time in New York

General racing discussion.

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TJ
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Postby TJ » Sat Nov 17, 2007 5:30 pm

Rokeby Forever wrote:
TJ wrote:Hey Roke,
Contessa, he's just got too many horses--talk about a success story. Violette believes it will be resolved before the deadline, so let's hope he's right. They can use the Lincoln tunnel (remember that joggin barn--smelt like oil) or Millers old shed where they galloped in the winter and the riders hit their heads on the pipes. The pony track is expendable if they think Aqueduct is. Get stronger riders or use a hackamore :>) TJ


1. Gary's success didn't go to his head - it went to his stomach. LOL! He lost b*tch-extraordinaire Maggi Moss last winter to Levine and it hasn't stopped him a bit.

2. I thought they burned that crappy jogging barn down.

3. You remember that old shed? It was called, "Thunk Alley" because that's what you heard when riders banged into the ceiling - THUNK! I do miss the barn, even to this day! Millionaire's Row just ain't the same any more.

4. That pony track always was and is great - I don't think the horsemen are going to let it get ripped up without a big fight. There's too much traffic on the Main track in the spring, anyway - it's needed.


Hey Roke,
I was gonna have em tear that pony track down if you needed some extra stalls, but OK we'll leave it up. Did you see Shug had a bid day in NY and KY. TJ

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Sat Nov 17, 2007 8:05 pm

TJ wrote: I was gonna have em tear that pony track down if you needed some extra stalls, but OK we'll leave it up. Did you see Shug had a big day in NY and KY. TJ

Hiya TJ. Thank you! That's very kind.

I saw that Hunting won the stake in NY. It's not too often you'll see Shug with a gelding, huh? Criminologist figured to win the stake at Churchill, but I didn't know the result until I just looked.

Shug can still win if he's got the stock. Too bad Dinny gives him nothing to work with these days.
What synthetics are to California racing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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Postby bdw0617 » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:14 pm

A glaring omission in the short-term agenda outlined by Spitzer is horse racing.

The franchise to run Belmont Park in Elmont, Aqueduct in Queens and Saratoga Race Course expires Dec. 31. Racing could be suspended if Spitzer and lawmakers cannot agree on an operator.

Asked about racing's future, the governor echoed Bruno's cautious optimism. "There are differences in vision and in practical impact ... but we will work through it."


http://www.newsday.com/news/local/state ... _headlines
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”
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Postby Rokeby Forever » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:35 pm

Elliot Spitzer is to NY racing what Charles Manson was to Sharon Tate.
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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Postby bdw0617 » Mon Nov 26, 2007 6:29 pm

The worst part of the disgraceful editorial in Saturday's New York Times about New York City OTB wasn't its gullibility in believing (and endorsing) Mayor Bloomberg's false claims of unprofitability and his empty threat to shutter the company. The lowest of many low points came in these two sentences:

"Shutting down the city's more than 60 OTB offices appeals to Mr. Bloomberg on both financial and moral grounds. Put simply, he believes that the city should not be asked to sustain a system that encourages people to squander the rent money or, worse, their lives."

It's no surprise that the priggish Times turns up its nose at gambling, but it is still astounding to see the so-called national newspaper of record dismiss hundreds of thousands of racing fans and OTB customers as deadbeats and judge their lives as worthless. Someday someone will explain to me why playing the horses is any different from speculating in financial and real-estate markets, pursuits that the Times routinely encourages its readers to sustain.



http://cristblog.drf.com/crist/2007/11/ ... g-our.html


I have said it once, and I wil say it again.. Roke, I know you love racing (hell youd on't even live there) but New York doesn't deserve racing. it is a privlage not a burden.
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Mon Nov 26, 2007 7:46 pm

Before simulcasting, OTB handled 2/3rds (or more) of the daily handle. It still handles the same volume, but it's less on a % basis because of modern out-of-state simulcasting. If OTB shuts down, NY racing will shut down - it poured $98 Million into racing last year that went to the NYRA - who's going to make up for that?

The track handle is crap - maybe 3,000 people go to Aqueduct on a weekday...half of them are $2 bettors.

Mike Bloomberg and Elliot Spitzer should both be chopped up and fed to sharks. How stupid are the people of NY electing these two morons? I'm glad I moved when I did!
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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bdw0617
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Postby bdw0617 » Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:42 am

here is another article

http://www.saratogian.com/site/news.cfm ... 2469&rfi=6

SARATOGA SPRINGS - Horsemen have begun contacting other East Coast racetracks in case New York's franchise isn't settled and horses have to be shipped out-of-state.
New York Racing Association's contract expires on Dec. 31 and state leaders still haven't decided who should run Saratoga Race Course, Belmont Park and Aqueduct.
There's a strong possibility that racing might be interrupted, and without a franchise, it's uncertain if the 2,300 horses at the downstate tracks will be able to stay there and train.
"We probably have a three-week window right now," said Rick Violette, president of the 5,000 member New York Thoroughbred Horsemen's Association, whose board met in emergency session on Tuesday. "Getting the Legislature back, even for one day, to deal with a racing issue might be an uphill climb. The stars might have to be aligned perfectly for this to get done, there's no question about it."
Philadelphia Park's stalls are jam-packed making Delaware Park the next best place to go, but it only has 800 stalls so the remaining 1,500 horses might be headed anywhere from Ocala, Fla. to Oaklawn Park in Hot Springs, Ark.

"It's not a pretty picture if it gets to that point," Violette said.
President and CEO Charles Hayward said NYRA will do everything it can to make the tracks available for training, even if the Dec. 31 isn't met.
"For how long I couldn't even begin to speculate," he said. "It's expensive to do that. I hope the lawmakers in Albany are paying attention."
It would cost anywhere from $600 to $1,000 per animal to move New York's 2,300 horses elsewhere. If that happens, some horsemen might not want to come back, which could seriously diminish New York's racing product if it resumes following a stoppage.

"That's the danger," Violette said. "If people have to bite the bullet, there's no question that any portion of them might stay put for a while."
Delaware Park isn't currently racing, so horses stabled there would have to be shipped to Philadelphia Park or Laurel Park in Maryland. One owner, upset by New York's unresolved situation, took six horses and went to Florida this week where he already has some horses stabled.
On Sept. 4, Gov. Eliot Spitzer called for NYRA to continue running the state's racetracks for 30 more years, while pledging to name an Aqueduct racino operator within 60 days. That self-imposed deadline passed 18 days ago and no announcements have been made.

Senate Republicans want to see a new public authority run racing and their plan includes gaming at Belmont. Earlier this month, Majority Leader Joseph L. Bruno said he expected a decision by Thanksgiving, which hasn't been reached.

"People in Albany are talking and I'm still hopeful that things are going to get done," Violette said. "But it's not that comforting to horsemen. You have to make plans. This is a business."

On Monday, NYRA submitted an amended bankruptcy reorganization plan. Brian Rosen, an attorney for NYRA, said the plan could be confirmed by late December, but that carrying it out depends on whether NYRA gets a franchise renewal.

"Neither NYRA nor the bankruptcy court has the ability to sway the Legislature," he said.

On a separate front, a Dec. 6 hearing has been scheduled for the Internal Revenue Service's claim that NYRA owes it $1.6 billion for the years 2000-2005. NYRA says it owes somewhere between $2 million and $15 million.
"We're working with the IRS," Rosen said. "We hope that the issue will be resolved before that time."



these guys are assclowns. they don't deserve racing, they elected these fools without knowing what their policy was on the issue. It's a damn shame. the pletchers of the world will be fine, but the mid level day to day trainers aren't going to just ship their entire barn BACK just because "hey we got it fixed" 2 monthsl later. Oaklawn is just getting in full tilt..we have slots, and when that's over you can go to Louisiana downs, and just around this area you have some GREAt purses.

I don't think anyone realises how much they are dropping the ball. when it's The the first week in june and the triple crown is put on hold because tehre is no third leg anymore, they will see.
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”

- Einstein

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:52 am

NY racing is swirling in the bowl.My trainer's barn is about 50% NY Breds - he's crappin' in his pants over the situation right now, and all he's told is "Wait and see."

Well, I guess there's always Finger Lakes. *sigh*
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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Postby bdw0617 » Tue Nov 27, 2007 1:00 am

Rokeby Forever wrote:NY racing is swirling in the bowl.My trainer's barn is about 50% NY Breds - he's crappin' in his pants over the situation right now, and all he's told is "Wait and see."

Well, I guess there's always Finger Lakes. *sigh*


you know what... I would venture that a race horse NY bred owner could sue the goverment, and they would have a fighting chance


Every Saturday morning when I get up and watch HRTV, as I'm cooking breakfast you know what i have to endure? These damn "bred in New york, it's the best thing ever" info mercials. every freakin saturday morning.

it's because of the incopintence of the goverment that the owners can't race in new york, not the NYRA (funny enough). if they are willing to put a cease to the goverment, they should also be willing to cut every owner a $100k check
"When the solution is simple, God is answering.”

- Einstein

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Tue Nov 27, 2007 1:15 am

bdw0617 wrote:it's because of the incopintence of the goverment that the owners can't race in new york, not the NYRA (funny enough).

Um...NO!

The State passed the VLT law SIX YEARS ago - still no slots. NYRA's fault.

NYRA, to retain the franchise, started a phony land claim suit. NYRA's fault.

Incompetence and corruption has put the NY tracks into bankruptcy. NYRA's fault.

The NY tracks are falling apart. NYRA's fault.

Stake races have been cut and/or canceled. NYRA's fault.

Scandal after scandal has plagued NY racing for years - NYRA's fault.

The NYRA MUST DIE!!!
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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Postby parsixfarms » Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:45 pm

Who would you propose to replace NYRA? There is not a single viable alternative at this time. The only real non-NYRA bidders left in the process are interested in the slots - and slots only!!

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:55 pm

Which group was headed by Dennis Brida and the horsemen (was it Empire?) That's who should control racing in NY - horsemen. Not egotistical morons that don't know a horse from an elephant and don't know what's best for racing. The horsemen are down in the trenches and know the problems - they can address them. Stuffshirt jackasses do nothing but prepetuate the problems.
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU

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Postby reese » Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:05 pm

Rokeby Forever wrote:
TJ wrote:The reason Spitzer gave the racing franchise to NYRA was because NYRA was giving up the rights to the land and turning it over to the State. That's when Bruno decided to get into the act. If he doesn't back down he will loose his voters come next election--but maybe he doesn't care. Could be a hidden agenda here, lets hope not. TJ

Hiya TJ,

C'mon, TJ - Spitzer forgave the $75 Million that The NYRA owes the state...that wasn't enough?

Spitzer is absolutely on the wrong end of this. He bought into the NYRA's land suit and decided to give them a 30 year franchise extension to drop the suit. But NYRA has no claim to the land! It's baloney!


Consider this: Elliot Spitzer's father and his real estate buddies want Aqueduct to turn it into a housing project. That's no secret. Now, if the State is given title to the Aqueduct property, what do you think Elliot Spitzer is going to do with it?

That's why this should go through the courts with a State appointee to oversee racing until this mess is settled. But not go to bankruptcy court - that forces a closedown. Take the tracks from NYRA...take the tracks from Spitzer...take the tracks away from the courts...put the tracks into the hands of an independent State office until the entire mess is settled. Then take bids and get the thing rolling in the right direction. That's how this should be resolved - just as Joe Bruno proposed.

NY racing might be doomed, anyway. Bloomberg wants to shut down NYC OTB - how is that revenue going to get replaced? That "swirl" sound you hear is NY racing in the bowl.
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/nation ... C-OTB.aspx



NYRA OWNS the land. They have the deeds and payed the taxes since 1955.

Why else do you think Spitzer HAD to return the franchise to NYRA?

If NYRA didn't own the land, some other politically favored entity would be running the franchise. NYRA was in court to file a suit re the land.

No issue. NYRA owns the land. A court battle will tie-up ny racing for years.

Bernard Liebman of Albany Law School, a specialist on (ny) racing,
said, "it was his legal opinion that NYRA owns the land"....contrary to whatever you are spinning here.

parsixfarms
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Postby parsixfarms » Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:06 pm

For all practical purposes, that group does not exist anymore. The horsemen withdrew their support for Empire this past summer (and even that support was the result of a backroom NYTHA Board vote in which self-conflicted guys like Bomze and Finley used their positions on the NYTHA Board for their own personal interests, as they were Empire shareholders; a majority of the horsemen in NY never supported Empire), as did Churchill, Magna, Woodbine, Delaware North and Marylou Whitney, among others. That group was headed by Jeff Perlee, an empty-suit if there ever was one. So I ask you again, if not NYRA, who?

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Postby Rokeby Forever » Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:18 pm

reese wrote:NYRA OWNS the land. They have the deeds and payed the taxes since 1955.


No. NYRA has leased the property - it never paid property taxes. If NYRA owns the land, how was the State able to stop NYRA from selling land to JFK airport a few years ago? How did the State stop NYRA from auctioning off the artifacts around Belmont Park?

Spitzer is full of crap. When he was DA and running for Governor, he was all out to get NYRA - he prosecuted the money laundering, the teller scandal, and everything else corrupt with NY racing. Once he became Governor, he forgave NYRA's $75 Million debt and went buddy-buddy with them. How much did NYRA contribute to his Governor campaign, by the way?

Spitzer's credibility in NY is ZERO. He's stuck in the Joe Bruno scandal, he torpedoed with the Alien drivers' licenses scheme, and his campaign people are being scrutinized for contribution irregularities. The guy is a complete scumbag and it doesn't surprise me in the least that he's in bed with the NYRA.

Who's been paying the NYRA's legal fees to this point? The $$$ has come out of services for the NYRA tracks. NYRA gives a damn about racing? They should be buried nose deep at Aqueduct's 1/8th pole and all horses should be made to wear caulks and bends!

Who should head racing? How about a horseman committee in Albany?
Last edited by Rokeby Forever on Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What synthetics are to California racing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gb0mxcpPOU