Announcement from the moderator

[Roguelet]

Moderating this board has become increasingly difficult. The entire tone of the board has done a drastic change. I'm honestly so torn as to what I should do about it. I LOVED this board the way it used to be, beginning in the dark ages, even before the switch to this format. This was a place where all things horseracing could be discussed and debated, and we could boast of a membership filled with wonderfully knowledgeable people and experts in every field of the game. While we certainly had our "wild times" and posts that would spiral out of control, for the most part people felt comfortable posting because they were treated with at least a basic level of respect... even if their opinions were argued into the ground, they themselves still felt welcomed, respected, and encouraged to post.

Over the past year or so, things around here have really changed. In my desire to allow freedom of thoughts and expression, and to welcome anyone who had enough interest to be here, I have allowed this change to gradually occur. Now, looking back, I feel that I have made a mistake.

Those of you who are relatively new, or who are so very wrapped up in your own posts and posts of your "buddies" certainly are not aware that we have, in fact, lost MANY of our core posters. These are people who originally developed this message board and helped to mold it into a place where everyone from the casual fan to the proven expert felt comfortable participating. I have been approached by many of these people over the past year or so, and they indicated to me their displeasure with the way this board was going, and their intent to leave. Some asked to have their accounts deactivated, and still others have just stopped posting without a word to me about it. I was able to encourage a few to stay on, but I fear those have left now as well.

I have been torn between allowing free speech and expression to everyone, and coming down hard on those few that are causing the changes. It has been this board's past policy not to squelch any person because some others might not like them or like their posting style. The difference is, in the past it seemed that our posters could accept and respect that policy and continue to be active members of this board, even if there were a few people that they clashed with. More recently, however, it appears that allowing a few people their freedom has changed everything so drastically that a good many are simply not comfortable here any longer.

I take full responsibility for allowing this to occur. I thought I was doing the right thing, but my hindsight is pretty clear at this point. This is something I should have addressed a while ago. Meanwhile, there are a lot of new posters who have no idea what the old board was like, don't know or miss any of those wonderful old core members, and don't notice the decrease in posting of those class acts who have stayed and continue to participate. Some of these newer members actually seem to enjoy the play-bickering, constant jokes, "messing" with other posters, belittling people, whether in fun or not, etc. that has become more and more commonplace around here. So, now I am faced with a decision; do I try to bring this place back to a more "businesslike" and respectful environment, where issues are discussed in a manner that more people are comfortable with, in hopes that those who have been leaving will return and people will feel more comfortable posting, or do I just chalk it up to evolution and wave good-bye to all of those people? No matter what I do, it will offend/upset some group of people, and I'm sure that group will attack me as being unfair and biased.

I have been mulling this over for a while, but some recent posts have finally moved me to action. Here is my decision: I am going to strive to bring this board back around to the comfort level that once existed. I still plan to allow freedom of speech and expression, but only if that is coupled with an appropriate amount of respect for the members of this forum. There is a difference between discussing opinions and belittling someone for theirs. There is a difference between asking questions and delving into a topic to learn, because there is a genuine interest, and following someone around to harass them. Those who cannot or will not acknowledge these differences and treat their fellow posters with respect will no longer be welcomed here. My tolerance level will be greater in the Off Topic forum (although I will not allow that to become a war zone) so perhaps some of you would do well to spend much of your time in there while you revisit what it means to have respect for each other.

This is going to be a popular decision with some, and unpopular with others, but I will not continue to sit by and watch this forum become divided while petty behavior causes people to leave here and go to other boards where they are more welcome and respected.

What this means is that, for a while, anyway, I will have to be more heavy-handed. For a short time, I will simply delete or edit posts that are not in line with the more respectful tone that this board needs to develop. However, it is your job as a poster to pay attention to your posts. If you see your posts being regularly deleted or edited, yet you continue to post in a manner that you know is not appropriate, your account will be deactivated. If I have to delete and edit someone's posts over and over and over and over again, I reserve the right to just deactivate them, with no slap on the wrist, no warnings, etc. We are all adults here, and every single poster on this board needs to be respectful and also be responsible for their own behavior. Blaming others or using the argument "He/She started it" will absolutely not fly. If you choose to continue posting in a manner that is not acceptable here, knowing the consequences, then you deserve what happens in return. If you sincerely have no idea or just can't understand that your posting style is unacceptable, despite having several posts deleted or edited, then you are obviously too engulfed in your own world to ever be trusted to follow the rules of this board... and if you're never going to follow the board rules, then you simply don't deserve to be here any longer.

I know this is going to make some of you angry, and I'm sorry for that. I'm sorry for allowing you to think that you can treat others on this board, myself included, like crap with no repercussion. I'm sorry that we've lost so many of our long-standing members, and I sincerely hope that once the respectful tone of this board has been restored, they will return and feel comfortable posting here again. I also sincerely hope that, even if you do not agree with my decision, you will support it and understand that I am really left with no alternative if I hope to bring back old posters, stop current ones from leaving, and encourage new ones to join and feel comfortable getting involved. If you can't respect that, then perhaps this is not the best place for you to be.

[Tucumcari]

Do what you've got to do Rogue.

[zinn21]

Rog, you have an excellent subjective view of the board and it's posters. By all means pull the damn trigger if we cannot have an ignore button.

[Dave C]

The evolution of a social group is very difficult to undo. If you can create the environment underwhich the original group formed perhaps you can recreate the dynamic that you seek.

I do find some of the banter highly amusing, but it is also tiresome to sort through pages of idle chatter trying to find a meaningful analysis.

As a member who remembers "the good ol' days" I very much know what has been lost, and wish you the best of luck in trying to fix things. To that end perhaps you could consider implementing a 1 post per thread per day per person limit to slow down the pace at which threads get hijacked and provide posters motivation to putting some thought into their posts before they posts, since a witty comeback will not be an option.

[Bid]

I agree with Tuc. Do what you think best. I haven't been a member very long, but I've been surprised by some of the nastiness. I came onboard to talk horse. I've been in the game 10 years now as a small-time owner. I value everyone's opinion because I realize I don't know everything. I'd hate to miss someone's insight because they were afraid to post. We've all been a success in our own lives, or we wouldn't be fortunate enough to afford these beautiful animals. Therefore, we all deserve respect.

[madelyn]

You have my support.

I deeply miss the really knowledgeable folk that used to lurk here who left because of the mudslinging.

[Outermonvolia]

Seems to me that your request for everyone to be civil is a fair one. If we all act like the adults that we are there should not be a problem and in time the board will be the better for it.

[valjoe]

Rog,
Although I don’t post very often I read the board almost every day finding it very helpful in many aspects, so do what you must to keep it the valuable source of knowledge it’s been so far

[winds]

I myself have found this board to be very informative. I don't mind the banter, it brings a levity to some of the threads. Having had worked on farms and at the racetrack, that kind of banter is the norm. It makes the hard work and disappointments less stinging.

I don't like it when it gets personal, whether directly or indirectly, but the light banter is ok.

Do what you have to do........... as long as it feels right to you and your heart, not because you feel backed into it.

winds

[Sam]

I don't mind the banter, it brings a levity to some of the threads.

When the topic of a thread is buried by nonsense, it's not acceptable. When the topic gets buried under a ton of noise by a few posters engaging in witless banter better left to PMs, it's not acceptable. It doesn't add levity to a thread, it makes the thread useless because most people are not going to wade through a bunch of noise pollution in order to find the meat of discussion. The really sad thing is it's happening more and more and not even always involving the same people.

It's like having an abandoned house in a nice neighborhood. One day there's a broken window. The next, some small graffiti. Then the door is broke down. Eventually the house is in ruins and the houses around it start to have problems. It's easier to maintain than it is to fix up and in this case, this board has now reached the stage of a fixer-up.

Topics are being buried almost before they even get started now. Some threads are being overrun by nonsense before they even get three responses because some people apparently feel this place is the online equivalent of their corner bar so everyone pull up a stool, grab a beer and let the lunacy reign.

Sorry, I'm didn't come here to read private emails or listen in on someone else's conversation and that's what a lot of this "banter" is.

[winds]

You're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to mine. Isn't that the point of this board?

winds

[Rokeby Forever]

I am going to strive to bring this board back around to the comfort level that once existed. I still plan to allow freedom of speech and expression, but only if that is coupled with an appropriate amount of respect for the members of this forum. There is a difference between discussing opinions and belittling someone for theirs. .

Bravo, Rogue!

I recently made a new friend on PQ known as DDT, a real ol' timer that's seen it all. He's new here, and we had a lengthy discussion, and while we disagreed on several points, I thought we had a great debate. Following our discussion, we received posts like this:

Congratulations to both of you-Roke and DDT. I have really enjoyed your discussion. As I'm sure others have also. Amazes me how you come up with all the statistics. I am more a student of pedigrees than racing, so I enjoy all the facts and figures you all throw out. Makes for interesting reading.

Thanks again for such an enlightened discussion and not a belittling argument.

I have to agree with LG - you guys had 6 pages of a sustained discussion where you were both civil, presented your viewpoints, supported them with facts, and did not resort to childlike behavior because the other didnt agree with your viewpoint.

WELL DONE! I enjoyed reading this thread very much. You two had/have an excellent debate going on here. Bravo for not resorting to childishness and name calling.

These comments made me feel good, and I'd like to participate in and read future discussions where members feel this way - that's what PQ should be all about. If Rogue can help meet that end, I'm for everything she proposes.

[spex4me]

Personally speaking sometimes it is hard not to go off topic in a thread. Forums have become as normal as water cooler chatter. PM'ing someone that I don't know is creepy, and until we have had 'public' expressions I don't do it or expect it. (my own personal preference)

Rogue, as a relative newbie and self-acclaimed smarta$$ at times, I would hope that if I as a poster cross the line you would PM me (your PM will not be viewed as creepy! ) Sometimes you really don't know when you've crossed it as each one of us has subjective measures of the subject.

I think though that whenever anyone pointedly attacks someone else like a pit viper then the content of the post should be deleted and if possible the edit text should say that this poster has been booted for __________ for X amount of time.

When you get a public group of people together you also have ever changing and differing dynamics. Ages,sexes,location,ect ect ect lead us all to have a different mode of operation. I surely would not want the task of proceeding over that. Thank you. (even if you do like Hokies and
Skins lol )

I can honestly say that I have learned something from or gained insight from every single person here. I really dig this place, and I'm the queen of anti social, but something about the common bond of TB's is exceedingly cohesive. I thank everyone, and I apologize to those of you who wish you had a "Spex Annihilator" button! Sorry for the ramble, but I seem to be a master of rambling.

[Georgerz]

I've just seen this thread. I agree wholeheartedly with Sam. I support Roguelet 1000%.

[Roguelet]

Thank you all for your support. There are a few comments here that I'd like to address:

As a member who remembers "the good ol' days" I very much know what has been lost, and wish you the best of luck in trying to fix things. To that end perhaps you could consider implementing a 1 post per thread per day per person limit to slow down the pace at which threads get hijacked and provide posters motivation to putting some thought into their posts before they posts, since a witty comeback will not be an option.

I have looked in the admin panel and cannot find a way to do something like this. The only thing remotely close is a flood interval, and I have increased the time there. Perhaps people reading this could just be adults, realize that incessant posting is both annoying and inappropriate, and have enough respect for those on the board to take the strictly playful banter posts to PM.

Having had worked on farms and at the racetrack, that kind of banter is the norm. It makes the hard work and disappointments less stinging.

There is such a huge difference between people bantering back and forth while mucking stalls, and posting such banter on a message board. It is the norm when in person, and I don't think a single person here would dispute that. However, on a message board, most people only have time to log in once a day, maybe every other day or once a week. It is ridiculous to expect someone to have to read through a week's worth or even a day's worth of snide comments and fooling around while looking for information. It's simply not appropriate here. It seems that the people who really don't seem to mind it have the ability to log on several times each day, so perhaps they truthfully cannot see how incessant this has become. Try not logging on for a week, then come back and check the posts. It might be an eye-opener for you. As an aside, MOST people involved in this industry are quite busy this time of year. It's foaling season, breeding season is about to begin, horses are racing, training, etc etc etc. I know I, myself, have 25 horses on site right now (several who are in foal) that I take care of each day, not to mention 2 young kids, a job, etc. It is frustrating beyond belief to check this board during a 5 minute break, in hopes of learning something new or enjoying some intelligent conversation, only to spend that entire time reading through childish banter, pointless joking back and forth, etc. A fun comeback or a joke thrown in here and there is NOT what I am referring to here... it is the constant posting of such "fluff" that completely buries threads that I am referring to. Many have become so frustrated at this, day after day, that they have chosen to take their precious little spare time and spend it elsewhere. Losing good members due to "flooding" of this message board is just not acceptable to me. If you are buddies with someone and want to chat back and forth; pick up the phone, email each other, or take it to PM.

Do what you have to do........... as long as it feels right to you and your heart, not because you feel backed into it.

I just wanted to clarify this... I would imagine anyone who has been here for any length of time already knows this about me, but for you newer people, rest assured that I am not the type of person who gets "backed into" action... ever.

These comments made me feel good, and I'd like to participate in and read future discussions where members feel this way - that's what PQ should be all about.

You have also been the recipient of many negative comments on many other threads, and if the type of comments you have chosen to quote in your above post truthfully do "make you feel good," then I hope that is the type of discussion we will see from you in the future. If you are truly being sincere in what you posted here, and your actions follow suit, then let me be the first to gratefully applaud you and guarantee that there will be no further issue with your posts.

Rogue, as a relative newbie and self-acclaimed smarta$$ at times, I would hope that if I as a poster cross the line you would PM me (your PM will not be viewed as creepy! ) Sometimes you really don't know when you've crossed it as each one of us has subjective measures of the subject.

You are correct, and I should have clarified that better. A new poster or one who has not previously been in trouble will not just be deactivated after an edit or two. That comment was pointed at those who have been in trouble before, have received numerous warnings in the past, and still choose to disrespect everyone here, myself included, by stirring the pot. These people have already crossed the line, most more than once, and do not need to be babied along any further. Most definitely, I am WAY more lenient with someone who is not a constant trouble maker, or one who may get heated or "go off" on one specific thread that is personal to them, but who does not do so on a constant basis.

Again, thank you all for your support; hopefully there will be precious few bumps in this road and we can all just get back to discussing the subject that binds us together and brings us here in the first place.