Barrets Sale

[Noor]

Louis, thanks, but don't understand why you are caught up on the evils of Phalaris. He was one of the soundest stallions in the stud book, both as a racehorse and as a sire.

[Ill-bred]

I also strongly disagree that a comparison of the race records of the highly-selective 2yo's against those of the entire yearling population is reliable. In a sense, these 2yo sales contain the cream of the crop of the prior year yearling crop.

Whoa!

The cream of the crop from the prior yearling crop will almost always go to end-users, not pinhookers.

The majority of pinhookers prefer to pay ~$50,000-$150,000 for a yearling. The high-level operations will up the stakes to $200,000 or $300,000, and rarely much more than $400,000.

The end-users get almost all the $400,000-plus yearlings.

[Noor]

Certainly the highest priced yearlings go the way of the end-user. That's why I tempered my comments by saying that "in a sense" the 2yo's sold represent a select group of horses. Pinhookers love a certain type that we are all familiar with, the kind of horse who will preview well at 2. I suspect their expertise in buying these types would translate into them buying later developing types, if that's what the market demanded. In any event, comparing a sub-group of horses to the entire population is faulty reasoning.

[madelyn]

I also strongly disagree that a comparison of the race records of the highly-selective 2yo's against those of the entire yearling population is reliable. In a sense, these 2yo sales contain the cream of the crop of the prior year yearling crop.

Whoa!

The cream of the crop from the prior yearling crop will almost always go to end-users, not pinhookers.

The majority of pinhookers prefer to pay ~$50,000-$150,000 for a yearling. The high-level operations will up the stakes to $200,000 or $300,000, and rarely much more than $400,000.

The end-users get almost all the $400,000-plus yearlings.

Also, a percentage of horses in the two year old in training sales are ones that RNA'd as yearlings. I would NOT consider those cream of the crop horses.

[tbrace]

The problem with this sale is you don't know what really sells, and what is a make believe sale set up between the seller and a fake buyer for whatever reason -

while the sales company looks the other way.

[mehile]

I understand why an owner would want to mislead. Making it appear there stud or horses are worth more by making fake auction purchases. But what confuses me, and this may be a question with an obvious answer, but why do the auctions allow that type of activity?

[tbrace]

Because they can't or won't take the chance of offending agents who consign high priced, or many, horses.

Look at the sale, find the people who ALWAYS run the fastest times, and then look at their sales.

Many of those sales will not be legitimate.

This is so rampant, that the sales company even makes back room deals with some consignors so that the consignor doesn't even have to pay full commission on the phony price.

Here's another unbelieveable practice: that same sale company will often send one of their favorite consignors as their official inspector to inspect and decide which horses get in the sale. Those few favored consignors often cherry pick the best yearlings for themselves by buying the yearlings before they ever get to the sale.

If the owners balk, the inspector/consignor says "Your horse won't get into the sale, but I'll buy it now for X dollars". The owner has little choice but to sell, usually for a reduced price.

Makes selling good horses by honest owners and consignors very tough.

The sales companies that allow these things to go on are killing themselves, and the industry. It drives honest breeders out of the game.

[Morvich]

You said it all, tbrace. Almost all, anyway. The high potential profits in these sales drive some trainers to betray their owners' trust by arranging for hefty kickbacks. Some trainers make more through this method than by training good horses. The sales companies turn the other way because high prices are good for their image.....and their ability to attract other good horses for future auctions.

The industry better pull the plug on these shenanigans or the government will end up doing it for us.

[tbrace]

Well said, Morvich. We better do something fast, or someone will do it for us.