Top runners and break downs

[Keith]

The breakdowns are very unfortunate. We breed for bigger, faster, faster growing and it is unfortunate some of the consequences like breakdowns, OCD, joint problems, and so on. Is it genetics or man made? So many foals are pushed to grow faster and pushed harder for two year old in training sales. We continue to saturate bloodlines with Mr. Prospector and Northern Dancer which leaves bloodlines with so much Nearco and Native Dancer bloodlines as a result. Mr. Prospector Northern Dancer is a classic cross but do we need to continue crossing the same bloodlines with each other. Yes horses are faster but many do not seem to last. Hopefully Big Brown is not pushed to the limit because he is so fast. Hopefully he is a freak of nature like Secretariat because the sport desparately needs a superstar. Having graded earnings pushes to start horses so many times against tough competition. I know it would be against tradition but wouldn't it make sense to have the Preakness as a prep for the Derby because so many horses are pushed extremely hard to get the earnings to get in the Derby and the turn around and run back in the Preakness which leads to a top runner or two in the Belmont basically running against allowance horses. Horses that are breaking down is happening too often and horses retiring so early leads to interest in horse racing being a seasonal sport from May to June as far as the vast majority of people drawn to the sport. With better television coverage we could have east verses west and north verses south and have somewhat of a playoff system during the year leading up to the Breeders Cup somewhat like the win and you get in. With poor or little coverage of the sport so much has been focused on the break downs when on regular television. Reality televison has done well and how more real can you get then horse racing.


Here are some top horses that have broke down

Eight Belles by Unbridled's Song-Away by Dixieland Band

3x4 Mr. Prospector
4x5x5 Raise a Native
5x5 Native Dancer

Go For Wand by Deputy Minister-Obeah by Cyane

5x5 Nearco

Ruffian by Reviewer-Shenanigans by Native Dancer

4x4x5 Discovery
4x5 Sir Gallahad III




Barbaro by Dynaformer-La Ville Rouge by Carson City

4x5 Nashua

Timely Writer by Staff Writer-Timely Roman by Sette Bello

4x5 Princequillo
5x5 Hyperion

Prairie Bayou by Little Missouri-Whiffling by Wavering Monarch

3x4 Bold Ruler
5x5 Tom Fool

Mr. Nickerson by Slewpy-Municipal Bond by Nashua

Union City by Private Account-Hopespringforever by Buckpasser

3x3 Buckpasser
5x5x5 Nasrullah


Keith

[hdembski]

nice post. Congress can't even deal with baseball and it's drug use problem. but i feel horse racing is worst. Humans make a choice to take a drug, horses have no choice, they trust us. And therein lies the trajedy. I think the problems start with the breeders, then the owners who want return on their investment, the trainers who succumb to pressures and do what they need to to win, and the industry as a whole. with the corporate dollar and greed not sure what will change if anything. Everyone seems to have an answer or excuse. I realize freak accidents happen but the average is 2 breakdowns per day. Well never hear about the $5k claimer but their life is valuable as Barbaro to me. I don't want the sport banned but there will have to be alot of research done and more stringent policies, rules and enforcement. I'd like to see trainers jailed if they give any horse anything they don't really need.

[Bill from WA]

Hi

Good point Keith, but inbreeding per se is not the cause on the problem. For every one of the examples you listed there can be a match with horses who are inbred, and have had long careers. I think that there are other factors that may be more significant.

A Diligent Ruckus (41-9-7-1)
4x4/5 Raise A Native
5/5x5 Buckpasser
6/6/6x5 Nasrullah

Aces of Gold (35-3-4-12)
3x4 Mr Prospector
4/5x5 Raise A Native
4x5 Tom Rolfe
5/5x6 Ribot
5/6/6x6 Native Dancer

Actress Ann (53-4-7-8)
2x3 Mr Prospector
3x4/4 Raise A Native
5/5x6/6/6 Nasrullah

Adjalah (61-7-9-11)
4/5x4 Raise A Native
4x4 Damascus
4x4 Gold Digger
5/6/6x5/7 Native Dancer
5x5 Buckpasser

Respectfully,

Bill

[Keith]

Look at some of the top sires

Nearctic by Nearco-Lady Angela by Hyperion

Nasrullah by Nearco-Mumtaz Begum by Bleinheim II 2nd dam Mumtaz Mahal

Royal Charger by Nearco-Sun Princess by Solario 2nd dam Mumtaz Begum

Mahmoud by Bleinheim II-Mah Mahal by Gainsborough 2nd dam Mumtaz Mahal

Northern Dancer by Nearctic-Natalma by Native Dancer

Raise a Native by Native Dancer-Raise You by Case Ace

Mr. Prospector by Raise a Native-Gold Digger by Nashua(Nasrullah)

Alydar by Raise a Native-Sweet Tooth by On-and-On(Nasrullah)

Roberto by Hail To Reason-Bramalea by Nashua(Nasrullah)

Bold Ruler by Nasrullah-Miss Disco by Discovery

Native Dancer by Polynesian-Geisha by Discovery

Blushing Groom by Red God(Nasrullah)-Runaway Bride by Wild Risk

Turn-To by Royal Charger-Source Sucree by Admiral Drake (3x3 Pharos)


When we keep breeding to the same bloodlines over and over again it has to have some factor on soundness.

Many bloodlines contain

Native Dancer
Nearco
Mumtaz Megum and Mumtaz Mahal
Nasrullah
Bold Ruler
Pharos
Phalaris

Great bloodlines are awesome but in the long run are we causing more harm than good to keep going back to the same bloodlines?

Big Brown is extremely line bred and line breeding can produce great runners but how many do not work out with extreme line breeding?


Eventually you need to find outcrosses

Keith

[Bill from WA]

Hi Keith

I absolutely agree that periodic outcrosses are necessary.

Bill

[Worksoplad]

A thoroughbred, by definition, is inbred since the thoroughbred species as we know it today was developed from just three Arabian stallions and a handful of English and Irish mares.

[Nighthenge]

Mr. Nickerson by Slewpy-Municipal Bond by Nashua

Nope, he had a heart attack.