My final post before the Belmont, I am going to Maryland for a Bar Mitzvah. We'll chat more when I get back... May all the horses come home safely. I hope everyone here cashes a winning ticket, best to you all!
In my humble opinion, here is what a Big Brown Triple Crown will herald... a new age in sport, a new era in horsemanship:
1) WINNING DEFINES US
Ethics, morals and integrity have taken a back seat to winning at any cost. Winning has become the only measure right and wrong. Welcome to horse racing 2008... where you become moral by winning. There is no tomorrow... we concentrate on today. We covet money, beginning today in race one and ending in race nine. After that, the suckers can worry about the breed, or the game, or the future. Today is mine, and I don't care if I hurt you, or the horse to get mine. Winning is right. And winning, regardless of cost, will decide our heros.
2) THE ETHICS OF COMPLICITY
If it's considered legal, I can use it. I SHOULD use it, regardless of the effect (as long as it doesn't stop me from winning). Its legal, no matter who made the rules, because once it's legal it becomes a good thing. I let the governing bodies decide what's right and wrong for me. Question authority? No more! I use every loophole and cheat I can, regardless of effect... because after all, it is legal. Just like business, horses are assets. Like gold, or silver. All the love, the heartfelt concern, the nobleness of the animals is silly romance, and doesn't put dime one in our pockets.
3) HORSES ARE SIMPLE COMMODITIES
Taking is the new giving. Charity begins with MY pocket. In our new skewed existence, we can somehow not only legitimize shooting helpless animals full of drugs, we can do it for there own benefit, AND we can do it WHILE we race them! Horses metabolize different, they are not human, they don't feel... they probably actually like it! We are lords and masters of those we WIN with, don't ever forget that. Who speaks for them? No one silly, there just horses.
I hope so very much that Big Brown loses. He probably won't, I understand that... but for all the reasons I know, I hope beyond hope that he doesn't complete the Triple Crown. Please Lord, show us the kharma. It's been 30 years, and now that I am into the sport, I feel cheated that my first glimpse of greatness is this horse, with these connections, in this situation and environment. We have waited 30 years and gotten this. Enjoy the moment. We Reap What We Sew.
One last point... In the movie Mr. Deeds (yeah I know, not a classic but it had it's moments) Deeds gives a big speech at the board meeting where everyone is talking about what they wanted to be when they were YOUNG. One guy says: I wanted to be a Ping-Pong champion! And Deeds says:
But you're not those things you wanted to be, are you? Everybody made a compromise, then another compromise, and now... you're about to put 5000 people out of work to make a quick buck? Come on. I bet if we ran into the 8th-grade versions of ourselves right now they would kick our asses and put Bubble Yum in our hair for even thinking about doing this.
Bravo.
The Triple Crowning Achievement
Moderators: Roguelet, hpkingjr, WaveMaster
Well put dray. I have a t-shirt that has all the Triple Crown winners on it. I looked at it the other night and I just could not picture Big Brown on the list after Affirmed. It doesn't seem right. If he indeed wins the TC, I will look at the new shirts with his name on it and I will see an invisible asterick next to his name...and it won't denote that he is a mudder in the old DRF symbology (if I remembered that correctly!)....
A horse gallops with his lungs
Perseveres with his heart
And wins with his character. --Tesio
Perseveres with his heart
And wins with his character. --Tesio
dray, I sit here reading your comments and it saddens me more than you know. You are new to this game. You came into this game with deep pockets compared to a lot of us. We're not jealous in the least, we have cheered you on with your successes at the sales and intently watched you and your friends deal at levels we only dream of. I and others have been in this game many,many years longer than you and have never even come remotely close to your success in the short time you have been involved in the business. But by your jaded words above it appears you fail to see what a TC winner means to some of us that enjoy greatness no matter who their parents are or who owns them!!! When you have been around horses for 50+ years and you see maybe two or three come along that deserve to be called "great" and a neophyte comes along and says how they wish this great animal loses because of who owns it. That is in my opinion one that has not paid the price nor appreciates the effort to get to that pinnacle!!! I hope you read this and not quickly react but take these thoughts and think about your words and maybe realize not all of us think a TC winner is anything less than fantastic no matter who owns or who they beat!!! He will forever go down in history as the 12 th great warrior in TB racing!!!
Wishing you the best,
Larrygene
Wishing you the best,
Larrygene
Great points larrygene, and thanks for the comments. Sorry to be a bummer, my intent was not to sadden, really. I love the game, still do... no matter what. I think your point is a big part I am hoping for his loss, all the greats that so many of you have watched in this game. I am a bit jealous! I wish I was more aware when I was younger. I can't remember Secretariat. Affirmed. Cigar. All the greats of the 70's. So many people I know were there in the 60's! The 50's! Even the 30's and 40's, can you imagine? It's for them, for you, that I feel the most sad. But hearing you makes me think that maybe I am too harsh. I dont know. You would have a far greater right to be offended, and aren't. Maybe I need to chill, but honestly, it is just how i feel. I am compelled to root for Casino Drive... but best to you and everyone who loves Big Brown. He has done NOTHING wrong. He is a horse and beyond reproach.
Thanks larrygene. All the best.
Thanks larrygene. All the best.
- Tucumcari
- Chef de Race: Brilliant
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- Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:51 am
- Location: Here and there
I have to agree 100% with you, Dray. Which sort of saddens me. I have waited most of my life for a TC winner. And again we sit on the brink of one and I am not excited or even looking forward to it. Maybe the last one I really was excited about was Smarty Jones. And that one left me disgusted. Though clearly not for the same reasons that I don't look forward to this one or even really like this horse. I feel a kind of disdain for the connections, for so many reasons. Some personal some well and publicly documented.
I too hope that someone can beat him, but know it won't happen. I want to be excited. I want to be full of hope at what a TC winner could do for the sport. But with Big Brown I am sort of Leary as to what this TC winner will do for the sport.
I sadly won't be thrilled and I won't see him as a hero who is joining the sports most elite group. I just don't think he is one of them. So many incredible horses have been on the brink and not gotten it done. Why should this horse with all of the BS that surrounds him become one of the very greatest this sport has ever seen? A horse who's career might well be over before he's back to the barn. He might never run against older, he might never run against a truly great horse. I DO see Curlin as great. And I'd love to see to see them lock horns!
Long winded as usual all to say, ya, you are so right!
I too hope that someone can beat him, but know it won't happen. I want to be excited. I want to be full of hope at what a TC winner could do for the sport. But with Big Brown I am sort of Leary as to what this TC winner will do for the sport.
I sadly won't be thrilled and I won't see him as a hero who is joining the sports most elite group. I just don't think he is one of them. So many incredible horses have been on the brink and not gotten it done. Why should this horse with all of the BS that surrounds him become one of the very greatest this sport has ever seen? A horse who's career might well be over before he's back to the barn. He might never run against older, he might never run against a truly great horse. I DO see Curlin as great. And I'd love to see to see them lock horns!
Long winded as usual all to say, ya, you are so right!
Proverbs 31:8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
tuc and dray, I can see it will not take another 30 years for you to appreciate a TC winner. It is going to take another 30 years of living to get you excited and to appreciate greatness for what it is. Pure and simple greatness without the periphery of ancillary influences. BB is a phenom. He's special no matter what else is attached. A win of the TC crown will only solidify that greatness. I suspect neither of you witnessed the battle of Alydar and Affirmed nor watched in disbelieveing awe the feat of I think the greatest horse that ever raced, the great Secretariat. Those are memories I shall never forget. And I dare say when or should I say, if, BB wins the TC you will carry that memory with you the rest of your lives. One cannot be complacent or remain unexcited when watching history being made. I predict that both of you will end up cheering loudly for BB if he has the right stuff to become racings 12th great warrior!!!
All the best to both of you
All the best to both of you
-
Bunty Lawless
- Allowance Winner
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- Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:05 pm
larrygene wrote:tuc and dray, I can see it will not take another 30 years for you to appreciate a TC winner. It is going to take another 30 years of living to get you excited and to appreciate greatness for what it is. Pure and simple greatness without the periphery of ancillary influences. BB is a phenom. He's special no matter what else is attached. A win of the TC crown will only solidify that greatness. I suspect neither of you witnessed the battle of Alydar and Affirmed nor watched in disbelieveing awe the feat of I think the greatest horse that ever raced, the great Secretariat. Those are memories I shall never forget. And I dare say when or should I say, if, BB wins the TC you will carry that memory with you the rest of your lives. One cannot be complacent or remain unexcited when watching history being made. I predict that both of you will end up cheering loudly for BB if he has the right stuff to become racings 12th great warrior!!!
All the best to both of you
Here, here! And I was an Alydar fan!
- Tucumcari
- Chef de Race: Brilliant
- Posts: 3754
- Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:51 am
- Location: Here and there
Big Brown's not a phenomenon, that's the problem. I've waited 30 years, Larry. He is a horse mired in tragedy and drama, controversy over hormones, and even more controversy as per his trainer's and owner's history. It' not pure. It's a disgrace.
For weeks I couldn't turn on the TV without seeing Eight Belles or the lynch mob looking to string up anyone connected. Then there is the hormone issue. Most of us know that hormones aren't what make him a good horse. He is a good horse beating up on mediocre. He's no Secretariat who is the measure against whom all good horses are judged for the last 35 years.
Big Brown is not Alydar and Affirmed. That was one of the greatest battles in the history of the sport! There is no comparison in my mind between them and him.
And honestly I really won't cheer. No word of a lie.
For weeks I couldn't turn on the TV without seeing Eight Belles or the lynch mob looking to string up anyone connected. Then there is the hormone issue. Most of us know that hormones aren't what make him a good horse. He is a good horse beating up on mediocre. He's no Secretariat who is the measure against whom all good horses are judged for the last 35 years.
Big Brown is not Alydar and Affirmed. That was one of the greatest battles in the history of the sport! There is no comparison in my mind between them and him.
And honestly I really won't cheer. No word of a lie.
Proverbs 31:8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
"...stand up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all those who are destitute.."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QawYXs2e ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIASWv9GYC8
Dray well said. My hubby even made the comment that it is a good thing we aren't going to NY for the race, reason being I would look like a gecko (albeit a pretty hefty gecko) running on top of the crowd of heads in pure ecstasy if CD or my boy Ready E comes in first. More so now for CD since his connections quietly scream 'horsemanship first winning second'.
Maybe if for this race Big Brown could have run without being medicated. I think I could then celebrate for him if he won. If he does win, I personally will feel like at a time racing needed Superman, we got Chris Benoit.
Maybe if for this race Big Brown could have run without being medicated. I think I could then celebrate for him if he won. If he does win, I personally will feel like at a time racing needed Superman, we got Chris Benoit.
trying to come up with something brillant..... this may take a while. 
spex, wait, wait, wait!!! Do you think that BB will be the only horse in the race tomorrow that will be on meds??? Do you think that all the horses that have in 140 years run in the Belmont ran drug free??? Come on now give me a break!!! Why is everyone dissing BB, because of his trainer and his owners? Don't you realize he was great before they bought him?? I'm sorry I can't believe people would be so biased and jaded with their opinion as to wish a horse failed because of who owns him!!! To me that is a pretty lame reason. Great is great no matter what trainer trains!!JMO
Larry , no that is another reason why I am reluctantly climbing off slowly of my Ready's Echo wagon. I don't know why I really have such distaste for the Big Brown machine (team). I guess my parents raised me to do the right thing as much as I could, but yet all I see are people doing the wrong thing and getting rewarded for it. This extends more outwardly to the connections of Big Brown as opposed to the horse himself. I do think he is a very good horse. I just want to see Big Brown au naturel. 
trying to come up with something brillant..... this may take a while. 
Human nature dictates that if the whole group around something leaves a bad taste in your mouth, the item itself will be left somewhat soured.
However, I am not excited about Big Brown and it has nothing to do with the connections, honestly because I've been too busy to pay any attention to them at all. I'm just not excited.
I have been excited enough to drive to New York to watch the Belmont twice when there was a triple crown on the line but not this time. (Of course, I made a vow that I would never do that again anyway... I do NOT Love New York!)
Honestly, I'm having a hard time really putting my finger on it, but I think it might be because Big Brown hasn't had to work hard for anything.
WAIT, DON'T GET UPSET... LET ME FINISH!
I KNOW that's not his fault, but I think that contributes to MY personal lack of excitement. If he had battled to win the Derby and the Preakness, the battles would've made me jump up and get excited. When a horse gets the perfect trip, is never challenged, and wins easily, you can just sit back in the chair and watch it happen. There's no perception of competition, and the competition is what really gets me excited about a race. Last year's Belmont, for example, was a competition. It was exciting. There was no way to stay in your seat and just watch that unfold. THAT is a memorable race and that's what gets me, personally, excited about watching a horse and looking forward to his next race. This year's Derby and Preakness? Yawners for me.
Now, couple all of this with the fact that there is a lot that I don't like about the way horses in general are prepped, trained and raced, and Casino Drive is an example against the things I don't like... and the fact that I feel the industry sorely needs the perception of crookedness and whatnot to be severely lessened, now more than ever... and I find myself drawn to Casino Drive.
Perhaps, if there is a real competition, a real horserace, in the Belmont, and Big Brown fights on and comes out a triple crown winner, my enthusiasm level will increase... but really, that enthusiasm would be focused on wanting to see him race again, so if he disappears after this race, then perhaps not.
However, I am not excited about Big Brown and it has nothing to do with the connections, honestly because I've been too busy to pay any attention to them at all. I'm just not excited.
I have been excited enough to drive to New York to watch the Belmont twice when there was a triple crown on the line but not this time. (Of course, I made a vow that I would never do that again anyway... I do NOT Love New York!)
Honestly, I'm having a hard time really putting my finger on it, but I think it might be because Big Brown hasn't had to work hard for anything.
WAIT, DON'T GET UPSET... LET ME FINISH!
I KNOW that's not his fault, but I think that contributes to MY personal lack of excitement. If he had battled to win the Derby and the Preakness, the battles would've made me jump up and get excited. When a horse gets the perfect trip, is never challenged, and wins easily, you can just sit back in the chair and watch it happen. There's no perception of competition, and the competition is what really gets me excited about a race. Last year's Belmont, for example, was a competition. It was exciting. There was no way to stay in your seat and just watch that unfold. THAT is a memorable race and that's what gets me, personally, excited about watching a horse and looking forward to his next race. This year's Derby and Preakness? Yawners for me.
Now, couple all of this with the fact that there is a lot that I don't like about the way horses in general are prepped, trained and raced, and Casino Drive is an example against the things I don't like... and the fact that I feel the industry sorely needs the perception of crookedness and whatnot to be severely lessened, now more than ever... and I find myself drawn to Casino Drive.
Perhaps, if there is a real competition, a real horserace, in the Belmont, and Big Brown fights on and comes out a triple crown winner, my enthusiasm level will increase... but really, that enthusiasm would be focused on wanting to see him race again, so if he disappears after this race, then perhaps not.
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"Don't be a boorish buffoon" -Hokies Respect 'Jerk Alert'
"Don't be a boorish buffoon" -Hokies Respect 'Jerk Alert'
I'm sorry I don't get it!!! The most talked about racehorse in the last 50 years is Secretariat!!! Which TC race was he challenged??? He won the Belmont by 31 lengths!!! He set track records along the way!!! Poor Sham as great as he was , was no competition for Big Red!!!! Every race BB has won he has destroyed the field!! When you have a million candlestick floodlight its makes a 100 watt bulb look mighty weak!!!! Could it be the competition is not that bad but BB is really that good??? I have no idea who will win the Belmont. I know who I hope wins. For the life of me I don't see how anyone that loves this game can't get excited about having another TC winner. Its time!!!!
Larrygene
Larrygene