Sahara Heat--New Stallion

[bcassidy]

Some good news to share with members who post on this board. Sterling Chase Farm in NJ will be standing Sahara Heat for the upcoming breeding season. He will stand for 5k LFSN.
A son of AP INDY out of a tremendous female family he should offer tremendous value for the breed to race breeder.
I will post some more information about him in the next week or so. For those not familiar with the NJ breeders program it offers tremendous opportunity for the small breeder. A mare bred to a NJ stallion can foal in any other state and the resulting foal can be dual state registered---an incredible value to the breeder. If you would like to know more about the stallion, the syndicate or the chance to breed to Sahara Heat on very attractive terms please send me a response to this posting and I will contact you to discuss this stallion in more depth. He could be a great opportunity for the regional breeder in MD, Va, Pa, NJ or NY. I will get more information posted on him in the very near future.
If anyone on this board has good or bad information on this stallion or his family I would welcome the opportunity to hear more about him.

[pokeyman]

Some good news to share with members who post on this board. Sterling Chase Farm in NJ will be standing Sahara Heat for the upcoming breeding season. He will stand for 5k LFSN.
A son of AP INDY out of a tremendous female family he should offer tremendous value for the breed to race breeder.
I will post some more information about him in the next week or so. For those not familiar with the NJ breeders program it offers tremendous opportunity for the small breeder. A mare bred to a NJ stallion can foal in any other state and the resulting foal can be dual state registered---an incredible value to the breeder. If you would like to know more about the stallion, the syndicate or the chance to breed to Sahara Heat on very attractive terms please send me a response to this posting and I will contact you to discuss this stallion in more depth. He could be a great opportunity for the regional breeder in MD, Va, Pa, NJ or NY. I will get more information posted on him in the very near future.
If anyone on this board has good or bad information on this stallion or his family I would welcome the opportunity to hear more about him.

His stud fee is too high...ridiculous. I think he should be half of the fee you listed and I venture he won't breed much with that price.

For Pete's sake, the best stallion and most proven stallion in the entire state stands for $6000!!! You can't bring a freshman sire in and expect that price. I don't give a crap what his pedigree is....

I will tell you this- most small breeders are going to be breeding very wisely this coming year and will not take chances. Take that for what you will......

We breed in the NJ program and are NJTBA members and so I have a stake in the industry.

Lastly, glad someone is bringing in another stallion to keep the NJ program going....

I wish them the best of luck. However, they must be patient and price accordingly. If he is worth it, eventually they will get the higher stud fee.

I mean Outflanker's numbers are crazy good as the 2nd best stallion in the Mid-Atlantic and they just bumped him up to $6500. So, lots of options out there for a stallion in that $5000 price range that are proven.

I would stand him for half of what you mentioned and wait until his kids run.

Let's face it, no stallion standing in the Mid-Atlantic area (other than Not For Love or Two Punch) will make any significant killing at the sales. So, their market is breed to race....

[tinners way]

Tremendous used more than once in a sentence makes me leery. Reminds me of a joke with using beautiful three times in a sentence.

I believe in hyping a stallion as much as anyone, and he deserves a chance at stud but the fee is way too high. As was pointed out, this is a breed to race region until the stallion is proven. It does sound as though deals will abound based on the post, and if the cost to invest in the syndicate is reasonable, he may be a good stud to breed to for years. Hopefully the dams get will continue to improve.

[bcassidy]

Pokeyman--thanks for your input. I agree with most of what you say in your response, however even stallions like Outflanker, Two Punch or Not for Love can't give you dual state registration and two of these stallions are over 25k. As I said in my original post we are going to try and get his book to 100 mares this year so we plan to be very aggressive with our breeding contracts and we have some unique ideas---- if you know a breeder who would seriously consider breeding to him in 2009 please ask them to speak with me and I can assure you that the stud fee won't be an issue but it is too complicated to go into in this thread. I think we have an excellent plan and hopefully he will be well recieved by the breeders in NJ, Pa, Md and NY. As I said in my original post I will have more information to release about him in the very near future. Dual state registration offers substantial value for the small breeder looking for that additional edge.

[bcassidy]

Tinners Way---the syndicate shares are priced at $12,500 and will be financed by the syndicate over a few years. There is a 70% Federal Tax Credit available to anyone who signs a contract in 2008.
Those breeders in Pa, NJ, NY and Md owning a mare or mares that match well with Sahara Heat will be well served to look closely at this opportunity. For almost the cost of two breedings you can own a share in a stallion with good potential to give you a very nice race horse, a stallion whose stud fee could increase in the next few years thereby increasing the value of your share and give you potentially "free" breedings to a proven stallion in a few years. It is certainly not out of the question with a stallion like Sahara Heat that if he produces some truly outstanding race horses he could be resold for a substantial increase in his purchase price yielding an even greater return on his share value. More information will follow in the near future....

[madelyn]

bcassidy - could you please explain the 70% tax credit? Thanks.

[tinners way]

It is hard for me to imagine that he could be valued at a half a million- this is based on a traditional syndicate of 40 shares- and based on the stud fee you are valueing the shares at 2.5x the stud fee. Correct? Is this a traditional syndicate?

While the scenario you describe is true- if lightning strikes in the first couple of crops, my feeling is the tops that could be considered is a 20-25k stud fee in KY- and that is a huge home run. But after Our Emblem and a few other notables, the moving from a regional base to KY- unless it is FL- is very, very rare. (and I am not throwing stones- I live in Texas and the move is into, not out of Texas to KY.- sorry Littleexpectations)

The reasonable scenario to consider is he becomes a successful regional sire and is able to appeal to those looking for "dual" registered foals to take advantage of state bred programs. Which means you have to compete with the surrounding states for those mares-even with the dual registry. Hard to justify the stud fee or the syndicate share investment.

For my money it would be better to consider a couple of mares that fit well with him and call you for a deal. It is hard to make a stallion and to overprice out of the gate I think only makes it harder.

[aurora]

I have to agree, he is priced way too high; this will mean some potential mare owners won't even consider him. I'd price him at $1,000 and give breaks to stakes quality mares if any apply.

[oliverstoned]

bccassidy you say "unique ideas" how about dropping the corporate riddle speak and just advertise at a real fee of say 2500 and offer discounts to nice mares.

[Bedouwia]

As the Syndicate Manger of a successful regional stallion in a struggling market (Uncle Abbie in Texas) I am certainly interested in any new innovative ideas. However, at first glance, this seems like a stretch. Our syndicate began with a reasonable share price, and then after our stallion produced good runners, the share price has increased by 50%. The combination of shareholder support and outside mares has allowed us to keep our numbers up in a tough environment. The reality is that a stallion has to be able to produce and prove his worth. This takes a few years. To me, 100 mares for a new stallion in a regional market at that price seems ambitious. I wish you well, and this country girl is ready to learn. Please keep us updated on the plan.

Bedouwia

[aardvark]

majestic warrior 20K might help this NJ stallion's cause. It is always easy to come down on your price, but going up without accomplishment is difficult. If majestic warrior turns out to be anywhere close to 20K then sahara heat might be a cheaper choice for folks. The Green Monkey is listed at 5K. Didn't think he was ever going to retire.

[pokeyman]

Pokeyman--thanks for your input. I agree with most of what you say in your response, however even stallions like Outflanker, Two Punch or Not for Love can't give you dual state registration and two of these stallions are over 25k. As I said in my original post we are going to try and get his book to 100 mares this year so we plan to be very aggressive with our breeding contracts and we have some unique ideas---- if you know a breeder who would seriously consider breeding to him in 2009 please ask them to speak with me and I can assure you that the stud fee won't be an issue but it is too complicated to go into in this thread. I think we have an excellent plan and hopefully he will be well recieved by the breeders in NJ, Pa, Md and NY. As I said in my original post I will have more information to release about him in the very near future. Dual state registration offers substantial value for the small breeder looking for that additional edge.

I will be honest with you.....the dual registration thing doesn't matter to most people.

Breeders who breed to race will go to the best stallion they can afford. Right now, NJ is competing with PA, MD, and NY (PA/NY because of slots and MD because they still stand the heavy hitters).

I can almost guarantee you that the only stallion getting breeders from Non-NJ resident mares is Defrere. I would put all my money on it. The only stallion to get the second most mares bred to him in NJ was Mo Mon and the majority, if not all, were NJ Resident mares and he stood for $2500.

Let's be realistic, the best most proven stallion standing in NJ, Defrere, stands for $6000 and bred only 44 mares with Mo Mon coming in at 30. So, a stud fee of $5000 on a completely unproven stallion and 100 mares bred is quite ambitious as was mentioned.

I don't mean to shoot you down or seem negative but I just want you to be realistic!!!!

Our region is a breed to race region.....You have to patient and let the kids hit the track.

Don't forget, in this economy you must tread lightly as well.

[bcassidy]

tinners way---it is a traditional syndication so you are correct on your valuation.

to all---I welcome your input. Why focus on a 2k or 3k savings in stud fee---will that savings really make a significant difference in your foals profitability? Your mares profitability? or your business' profitability? Penny wise and pound foolish is never a profitable strategy.
We are targeting the "breed to race" breeder in NJ, NY, Pa and Md. the breeder who owns one or possibly several mares. For many of the same reasons we all own our own home (tax benefits, price protection, equity appreciation) as well as a few other benefits we get only in a stallion syndication (multiple mare bonus breedings coupled with the ability of the syndicate to add significant future income in the form of Stallion breeders awards and outside mare breeding income down the road. The syndication will be mailing you checks and still providing you with seasonal breeding rights and or the right to sell those seasonal breeding rights on a yearly basis if you can't use those breeding rights down the road) an own rather than rent strategy is a much more intelligent option. This is how the most successful players in the game run their breeding business and it is available to everyone---not just the very wealthy.
The Sahara Heat share owner will have multiple bonus breedings during the first four years of the syndication and the share price can be financed by the syndicate over 3 years. For those share owners wishing to pay up front---there will be a 20% discount.
For those breeders wishing only to breed to him on a seasonal basis----then the stud fee can be "paid from proceeds" of the foals future race earnings. If the foal is sold before it races then a 2,000 stud fee is due immediately. If the foal doesn't earn any money than you don't owe a stud fee but with just one or two of the benefits listed above why wouldn't you buy a share rather than breed to him on a seasonal basis??? for the cost of two breeding seasons you can own a share of him and get all of the additional benefits listed above. The bottom line for the regional breeder is why only own one half of the resulting foals pedigree when you should and can own 100% of the pedigree.
Targeting the state bred programs is an exceptional strategy to make money in this game (if you don't fully understand this strategy then you need to make an effort to learn about them) but assuming everyone reading this post understands their value---doesn't it also make sense that if you can participate in 2 or 3 states programs simultaneously then that would be an even better decision? NJ gives you that option so I submit that owning a stallion standing in NJ is the best possible option. I don't want to say much more about this point here but if you would seriously consider purchasing a share in Sahara Heat than please PM me and I will give you some of my thoughts on this tactic ---it is quite compelling.
I certainly welcome comments or questions on any of my above statements. I come to this board because I love this game and I always want to learn as much as I can about it but I also try to help as many people as I can while I am interacting on this board. Stallion syndications, whether it be this or some other, is a valuable strategy for any breeder in this business. If you don't have this strategy covered in your business plan than you need to learn more about it and make sure it wouldn't be a better option for you. In most cases I would venture it makes a lot more sense than some people might imagine. To the extent that I can help educate someone on this strategy I feel very satisfied.

[bcassidy]

madelyn---I will get some reference material for you and forward it on. There is a 70% accelerated depreciation schedule for equine investments purchased during the 2008 calendar year. Our accounting team will be validating that a contract signed (but not paid for) in 2008 will qualify for that treatment. As always I think it is always the best advice on tax matters to speak to your individual advisors. If the contract signing doesn't give you the benefit than at least those in a position to front the money will have a huge advantage on any equine investment this year. It is definitely something to know about if you are going to be in a position to purchase this year.

[bcassidy]

Pokeyman----many of your comments are spoken from only the owner of a mare perspective. I respectfully submit you may be missing some of the value in your breeding decisions.
Dual state and even three state restricted options are a huge bonus. If they are being minimized than people need to look at it closer. I can't imagine why someone wouldn't take advantage of this option if you could. The benefits are enormous. I will try and give a few big ones here but by no means will this be conclusive.

Restricted bred race eligibility in two/three states. Many more options and year round racing opportunities.
state bred and open race conditions effectively doubles your opportunity to make money with a foal. Not every state treats this the same.
black type credentials in two/three state bred programs--great value and options for your breeding program
Multiple track, surface, jockey and trainer options--Monmouth, Presque Isle Downs, Penn National, Finger Lakes, Saratoga, Aqueduct, etc. You have a much wider assortment of options to fit your horse and or budget.
Mutliple distance, surface, track, jockey, trainer options---usually within the same time frame. If I have a Pa/NJ bred I might have 10 races I can shoot for within a 30 day time frame vs just the 2 or 3 I might have open to me with just a single state eligibility.
The state bred breeders awards programs are huge advantages. Pa gives you a 40% bonus and the ability to go open AOT while NJ would pay you for Out of state wins while their season is closed.
Increased sales value for your preraced horse.
Higher claiming values for your racing stock.
Limited foal crops in some states are a huge competitive advantage.
Black type ability easier in some states--easier competition
Black type options better in some states----grass, synthetic, 5f-1 and a half mile options.
Many many more to list almost too many to do comprehensively. I love these benefits.....and you only get the maximum advantage by breeding to a NJ stallion. That's why you don't hear more about it... Most people in NJ not taking advantage of it and most out of state to NJ breeders not sending their mares to NJ to be bred... It represents great value for out of state (from NJ) breeders.