Nervous?

[AscotStud]

Tejano Run covered 18 mares in Canada and Aljabr covered 5 in Kentucky this year, so with Impeachment gone it would not take many bookings to be ahead of last year, would it?

Actually we are ahead of any year we have ever stood stallions at this point. Aljabr, Clifton Park and Tejano Run all have over 10 booked to them so far. You rarely see a full book in Canada, so to have this many at this point does not make us "nervous". We are quite confident that all of our stallions (including Impeachment who is now in Iowa) will breed more than last year.

Sales were down, but I don't know many people who didn't expect that. You can't keep breeding more and more horses of less quality and expect the average to keep climbing. We were due for an adjustment.

As for hay the prices are still high here and it is still hard to come by. We have been trying to get quotes from contractors to build another barn for the past 2 months and they are finally getting back to us because they are too busy with jobs. The restaurant I'm involved with has been ahead every week compared to last year.

I agree that some fees in KY were and are way too high, but people kept paying them, so how do you blame the farms doing that. Just like prices for some yearlings started to get out of control. That's the free market working, I think we are seeing and adjustment on both ends which should keep the train chugging along.

There have been recessions and drops in sales prices before and things have always bounced back. If the chain is broken and somehow things never do, then I guess I'll have to fall back on my degree and get a real job.

[Jenny]

I am not worried. My life does not depend on it. If my stallion only breeds a few of my own mares then so be it. I put his fee up this year, because it was too low to begin with, for such an accomplished boy. If people want to breed then they can pay for it. I am so sick of people wanting something for nothing. I am putting all my hard earned money into this, why should people expect something for nothing. I have always paid for my stud fees, and no one has given me anything for free. So pay of piss off!!!!!!

The big farms are worried, they would rather give away stud fees to get the boarders money, then have the barns sit empty. Darby Dan is sending out unsolicited free breedings to people who never even contacted them!!!!
Others are paying incentives to breed to their stallions, no wonder their numbers are up. Free money to breed your mare.

[Jenny]

Just to clarify. I am not taking about the small breeder who has been getting ripped off by the big farms for years. Paying way too much money in stud fees and barding costs etc. I am taking about the people who just want something for nothing. Have never paid a stud fee in their life and don't ever plan on it. They will breed to whatever stallion that they can get for free , doesn't matter if their matches well or not. As long as they don't have to pay. Want a deal on the board or you to do a foal share and you put up all the expenses. If you have a stud farm, you know the "type" I am referring to. They are also the people who choose the cheapest trainer possible, doesn't matter about his or her record or inexperience, as long as they are the cheapest person at the track. So who wants them getting hold of one of your foals. They just bring the records down.

I am all about letting the little guy get ahead. If someone genuinely wants to breed and would like a reduction in the fee, or if they have a really nice mare. Then great. But the ones who try to make you feel like they are doing you a favor and want you to take the hit for all the expenses. I am not interested. Go pedal your wears somewhere else. See how you make out in the long run.

[Maureen]

The point is, stallion owners must offer incentives or give away breedings to get the mare owners to consider their horse. A stallion may be wonderful, and have earned lots of money in graded stakes and allowance races, but people want value for their money, espcially with an unproven stud. You keep the stud fee low until those first babies hit the track at two and then either up or lower the fee accordlingly.

As mare owners, we also know what it costs to get a mare in foal, keep that mare in foal for 11 months, foal out, register said foal, hope you can sell quickly, or wait for the sales, and if need be, race it yourself. Why wouldn't a mare owner like some concessions from the stallion owner? We've got a lot more invested in time/money than the stallion owner does.


Yes, Jenny, you are correct about people that want something for nothing and don't want to pay board and don't want to pay stud fees and want to foal share.

You have a wonderful horse in Gone Fishin, and would truly love to see him do as well as he deserves, but the tone of your posts come across badly for someone hoping to promote their stallion. As a stallion owner you have to take the good with the bad, and if that means offering incentives, giving away free breedings and honouring previous agreements, then so be it.

I do wish you success with Gone Fishin as he stands at your own place this season. I hope you are ready for some hard work!

[Stormchaser]

I think that we are all in agreemant that if someone wants a deal on a stud fee all they have to do is sit down with the stallion owners and talk. We are not giving them away though as where would that get us? With all the bills that piled up from shipping to Kentucky last year and getting nothing except for more vet bills from a very sick mare shipped home empty and she had to have surgury we are not taking any offers from the Kentucky crew this year. We did get an offer for a free fee from Darby Dan but we are not taking it. I personally am giving my mares a year off this season and have given 4 mares away free to good CSH homes (2 of them prgnant). I am tired of mare owners that do not pay and have had to put 4 individuals into Small Claims court! That lit a fire under one guys ass but because of people like this we are not open to do the deals that we once were. We call it the Hulley Syndrome around here! Most people around here trailer breed as well so if we give a stud fee away what do we get? If mare owners want to breed then they have to pony up somewhere although we are being very particular about deals because of the Hulley Syndrome. I can personally see where Jenny is coming from, she is frustrated and I totally get that. We have always paid for our stud fees and never gotten anything for free. Shipping to the States also does not help the Ontario breeders at all and as an industry that could fail we need to be supporting each other instead of shipping to the US. I have thought about this alot and if there is no place to race and no stallions due to lack of support from the mare owners it becomes non feasable to breed. Lets try to give each other the support that we need to keep the Ontario race industry alive and support your local stallions. A free stud fee to a Kentucky stallion adds up to huge shipping, stabling and vet costs. In the long run it is cheaper to keep your mare in Ontario .

[LB]

I guess I'm glad I'm not trying to breed my mares in Ontario.

[MINNOW]

Lb
That is the sad part,small community and bad feelings for what ever reason.
We do have some nice stallions here and mares.
At present we are facing the possible closing of our local track,so a lot of mixed emotions right now.Even Woodbine is closing some of it's features.
The economy sucks here the same as in the U S
Personally as a stallion owner and breeder I would not consider a stallion other than Ontario bred the benefits are worth breeding here.As for people that want to go to Kentucky or any where else that is their dollar and I truly wish them all the best.
We breed to race my husband has his trainers license so it is not as though we have to pay training fees,and even if we only breed our own mares then he will get his chance to train a really nice crop of Gone Fishin foals,after the load of crap he has had in the past it will be very refreshing.

[Jenny]

I think I am used to a little hard work. I have 21 horses in the barn right now, and they get very well cared for. I also have a few in for breaking a training, doing clinics and giving lessons to my students on top of all that. So I think handling my stallion will be pretty easy. Don't you know we are all mare owners. Like we don't know that costs involved. I have always paid full price for my stud fees and incured all the costs of getting my foals to the racetrack. I have not unloaded them onto other people to get going, because I have not wanted to pay to get them to the track myself!!!

I am sure I won't be complaining every time I breed a mare!!!!

Stormchaser: I know what you mean about the Hulley Syndrome. I have never personally had that happen to me. I have always said and stuck to it. I don't do partners, it never ends up well. Some one always gets screwed in a deal like that. So I choose not to ever go that route. It is one way to find out who your friends are, peoples true colours always show though!!!!!

[LKR]

The breeders in Washington have overlooked our stallion, Top Account, for the past 3 years. The ones that have bred to him all comment they are the best looking foals their mare has ever had. He will put the stamina in the foal for all the speed bred mares we have in the Northwest, plus he won't diminish the speed, just enable the foal to carry it further that 6 f.
I know exactly what you all are talking about. One guy wanted to breed 15 mares to him for virtually nothing. Didn't want to pay board for 2 out of every 3 mares. I didn't even e-mail him back.

[native diver]

All I can say is WOW!!! Why so nasty. If it wasn't for mare owners their would be no foals. I thought Stallion owners wanted foals on the ground? When standing a Stallion are you not trying to sell a product? If you don't want to make deals that is fine but just smile and say no thank you.

[soft hearted]

Can one of you explain or define this "Hulley Syndrome" thingy? The phrase "trailer breed" as well? I need a new dictionary!
Maybe then I can understand the anger you seem to be feeling

[madelyn]

All I can say is WOW!!! Why so nasty. If it wasn't for mare owners their would be no foals. I thought Stallion owners wanted foals on the ground? When standing a Stallion are you not trying to sell a product? If you don't want to make deals that is fine but just smile and say no thank you.

Stallion owners like me certainly want foals on the ground but if I'm going to feed a mare at my cost then I am going to own the darn foal.

It is unreasonable to expect to pay no stud fee, and no mare care, or even to try to get mares in a 3 for 1 for mare care - which is all cost.

[LKR]

Whoa, everyone. I should have clarified that I was referring to a "get something for nothing" no good piece of poop. He didn't take care of them, they weren't trimmed, vaccinated or anything else like they should be, so he basically wasn't putting much out. When someone doesn't have much of a vested interest they tend to not take care of things. I have been a mare owner who paid stallion fees so I know how it goes. I got some deals but most of the time not. I appreciate that people want to save a little here and there. Please accept my apology as coming across as a stinker.

[native diver]

So pay of piss off!!!!!! Very Happy

I guess the way things are said. With this being a public forum it certainly doesn't seem the right way to do business.

[Jenny]

We are all mare owners as well. I have had more foals and bred more mares than most of the people here complaining and wanting a deal. I have always paid full price for my breedings and even when I had bred two mares to the same stallion and never even asked for or was offered a deal. It is funny how things go when the shoe is on the other foot. Now other people want to breed and don't want to pay. I don't understand it.