Average Earnings per Starter

griff · Postby **griff** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:43 pm

Lord Jim was described by Joseph Conrad as someone to whom you would relinquish command of the ship based soley on the manner in which he mounted the bridge.

I had not noticed the filly thing with Limit Out but the one I'm presently following, Limitmenot is a filly.. I'm expecting one in early April and another in May and I was hoping for colts, now I'm not sure.

griff

Patuxet · Postby **Patuxet** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 7:42 am

IMO no index is truly useful until the comparable earnings index for the mares to which a stallion has been bred is factored in.

griff · Postby **griff** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:05 am

Patuxet

I agree that date would be very usefull; however, if that dat is not available I would be forced to assume that the top five stallions in the nation would get better mares than the five stallions I looked at from the Mid Atalantic.

If that assumption is correct, and I think it is, would it not be reasonable that the average earnings per starter from the top five stallions, with their superior KY mares would be much better than the five Mid Atlantic stallions with their "very average" Mid Atlantic mares.

Instead the Mid Atlantic stallions have almost as good "average earnings per starter" numbers as the top ten stallions and their superior mares and better % winners from starters.

griff

st. louis kid · Postby **st. louis kid** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:36 pm

Something not being included in the equation is that many fillies by top class sires do not race on in their careers. If they show little talent or show a lot of talent, their careers are cut short and off they go to the breeding shed, while mares out of cheaper studs usually race as long as someone will have them.

griff · Postby **griff** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 7:51 pm

Seems like a well bred filly, out of an expensive stallion would be worth a lot more as a brood mare if he raced and had a couple of stahes winns..

Howeverf, I do agree there is not much use in running a filly that can not run

griff

DDT · Postby **DDT** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 am

griff

I looked at this yesterday and after some research I think you should wish for fillies from your two mares. Limit Out was not well received in New York and after one season moved to West Virginia in 2005, the Jockey Club reports that from his first WV crop foaled in 2006, 2 year olds of 2008, he had 6 reported live foals, therefore I think it is safe to say that the majority of his progeny earnings for 2008 were earned by Florida breds, not Mid-Atlantic. His leading earner, Any Limit is a homebred G2 and G3 winner and she has already won another G3 this year contributing $125,000 to his earnings for 2009. To date, and I know it is very early in 2009, but he is listed as having 8 runners with 2 winners and the one stakes winner, Any Limit. Of his 7 leading earners, 6 are fillies, and of his 4 stakes winners, at least 3 are fillies, I could not find the 4th.

These stats can be very misleading, and because Limit Out has a limited number of runners, big earners can make him look very good, the median would be a much more realistic stat.

I wish you luck with your two mares and their foals. Keep the faith.

DDT

cewright · Postby **cewright** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:40 am

griff wrote:Seems like a well bred filly, out of an expensive stallion would be worth a lot more as a brood mare if he raced and had a couple of stahes winns..
griff

Griff - I think it depends on the owners goals. Time and time again I have run across marvelously bred mares that seemed to show a lot of racing aptitude in their limited race careers. It seems many of these were owned by breed to race outfits with deep pockets and lofty goals. I suspect these mares headed to the breeding shed early as their highest value to the owners was the potential to produce a big horse for the owner to run. With this understanding I am becoming less critical of the lack of a "commercial" page on these well bred mares particularly if they were owned by known breed to race types.

Chuck

Chuck

griff · Postby **griff** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 1:26 pm

Chuck

Maybe this has gone on long enough but I still do not understand why a "Breed-To_Race'"owner would send a filly to the breeding shed early; i.e., if he is a breed-to-race guy why does he not race her??

griff

Joltman · Postby **Joltman** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:14 pm

Does anyone know whether Equineline or Bris offers median calculations? A median with a standard deviation would be very helpful for determining how the distribution of earners goes. The raw numbers are not that helpful. I tend to look more at the percentage of SW, black type earners, superior runners, etc. when that is available.

jm

foxtale · Postby **foxtale** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:44 pm

We stand Smart Guy a horse who does not have a large amount of foals.
According to the TB Times:
Smart Guy is

#1 Pennsylvania sire by lifetime average earnings per starter ($77,178).

First four crops: 70% starters ... 14.3% SWs.

Sired the brilliant, record-breaking sprinter SECRETINTELLIGENCE out of a $1,500 mare. Winner of the $100,000 Captain My Captain H. in 1:08.81 for 6 f., and 2008 Penn National 6 f. NTR setter in 1:08.67.

Ranks in the top 1% of all sires by average earnings per start ($6,431).

AEI of 2.38—nearly 2 1/2 times the national average.