Zenyatta HOY

[JimbleBrimble]

...money to prove...

Oh, I think this person wants to bring money into the equation:


Z - $3,330,000

R - $2,746,914


nuf said!


(thanks for bringing that up)

[JimbleBrimble]

I don't often agree with JimbleBrimble (he comes across as a grumpy old man)

That's funny, while looking back at ancient posts today, I was contemplating bringing your old and absurd forecasts and expectations about both Alberta racing and BC racing into the present.

Lets just say that the giant tidal wave of BC horsemen expected (by you alone) have not invaded Calgary this year.

Although, with Grande Prairie being so near to the border, I suspect that some probably infiltrated the stables there for those long evenings in early summer.

You remain entertaining for everyone here.

[spinround]

...money to prove...

Oh, I think this person wants to bring money into the equation:


Z - $3,330,000

R - $2,746,914


nuf said!


(thanks for bringing that up)

Lol way to take the quote I was responding to totally out of context! But how 'bout that money question?

This year Rachel won:
1 $1.25 million race
1 $1 million race
1 $750k race
1 $554,500 race
1 $400k race
1 $300k race
1 $245k race
1 $50k race

in comparison Zenyatta won:
1 $5 million race
3 $300k races
1 $150k races

To put it another way, from May - October Z raced for purses worth $1,050,000 while from May through September Rachel ran in races worth $3,854,500. But running in top races through the course of the year seems like a silly idea since, obviously, there is only one race that matters

[Matchemforever]

Well, yeh, I did kind of compare RA to Precious Passion.
Both have high cruising speed.
Both are going to be giving it everything they got even if the tank is running on fumes.

Somewhere else it has been said that 1-1/8 is the fillies "classic" distance, and 1-1/4 the males "classic" distance.

If you look at it that way, RA beat the males at her game,
Zenyatta beat the males at THEIR game.

Personally, I think the term "classic" should be applies to 1-1/2 miles and up, but I'm pretty alone in that thinking these days.

[JimbleBrimble]

from May through September Rachel ran in races worth $3,854,500.

Dude, maybe we'll change the award to:


"Horse of the May-through-September"


(although it may be a little long for the trophy people)


But then again, Rachel Alexandra couldn't last through September, so by rights she would be ineligible.

[Hops]

Rachel's owners put up their money to prove she was the best three times more than Zenyatta's owners, and she did prove their point. She proved it in one more G-1, two more victories against males, at four more tracks in five more states than Z did.

Rachel's current owners only raced her 3 times.

[spinround]

Lol I tried to cover the same span the two were racing as a means of comparison. Rachel ran three times outside of that time frame, Zenyatta once.

[wallinga]

What I think is amazing is that Zen is unbeaten with THAT running style. A horse witha style like that leaves a lot to chance, in fact if she wasn't an herculean race horse, I'm pretty sure she would have been beaten on the weekend too.

[Des]

Personally I feel that Horses that are lacking speed such as Zanyetta are not given enough credit. There are certain bias against them. If she was winning her races on front end she would be touted as one of the Greatest ever. I Think people in general tend to favor horses that show speed as being superior as compared to the Plodders or closer who does as well..... ZANYETTA HORSE OF THE YEAR ....she showed up for the big dance and and not just won.... She rocked....

[reenci]

Listen up you Zenyatta naysayers....RA'S connections had all year to test her on the "rubber road"......they choose not to....who is to say she would not have liked it....what... just cause CURLIN didnt like it ?....CURLIN lost the breeders cup last year for the most part because he was already over the top......he had struggled to beat "pass the point in the woodward" and i belive his previous race was also a struggle against horses he should have crushed.......the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP was to be held at SA in 2009....everyone KNEW THIS AHEAD OF TIME....just cause curlin didnt care for it does not mean RA WOULD NOT.....SO PISS POOR PLANNING ON on JJ's part is not BIG Z's connections fault.....boo hoo...im taking my toys and going home......guess what buddy? your not bigger than the game and its going to cost ya......YOU DONT SHOW UP FOR THE BIG GAME..?........ bafoon.

[karenkarenn]

The thing is is, Curlin lost in the BC and I believe Red Rocks beat him too, i think it was on the turf maybe Man O WAr?. But he got HOY-- So apparently to this panel of people I believe its truely a popularity contest.
We may be talking about it till where Blue in the face, but this might blow up for Zenyatta because she not as Popular as R.A.
Karen

[FOS]

hi Dave C

... The whole point of stakes races is the owners putting up their money to prove that their horse is the best. RA's connections did not do that and therefore the trophy should not go to them.

Bull's-eye !!! Bingo !!! Exactly !!!

For reference, for what it's worth...you'll likely recall racing year 2004. Pico Central won (in 2004) the 6 furlong Grade 1 Vosburgh...absolutely positively crushing/smashing/embarrassing Speightstown (who finished 3rd in that race). If that wasn't enough, Pico Central also won (in 2004) the 7 furlong G1-Woodward (oh by the way Speightstown did not run in it). Okay, if that wasn't enough...Pico Central also won (in 2004) the one mile G1-Metropolitan Handicap (another race that Speightstown did not run in).

Fast forward...Team Pico Central decided to pass on the Breeders' Cup Sprint. They made it very clear, they felt they had the sprint eclipse wrapped up; and by the way didn't want to put up the big bucks to supplement Pico C.

Didn't seem far-fetched...after all Pico C had already won three Grade 1s in 2004 (all prior to the Breeders Cup), and the super-fast Pico had already crushed Speightstown when they faced each other in the Vosburgh.

I for one thought Team Pico was taking a risk by passing on the Breeders' Cup sprint. Maybe not an unreasonable risk...but a risk nonetheless. If Speightstown didn't win the '04 BC sprint, it was all but certain Pico C would be awarded the sprint eclipse. If Speightstown did win the BC sprint though...then what might the voters do? Hmmm.

Fast forward...Speightstown won the BC Sprint and was awarded the sprint eclipse. Hard for Team Pico to swallow I'm sure. After all Pico had won three brilliant Grade 1s in 2004, Speightstown but one...but it was the BC sprint.

After the Pico Central-less Breeders Cup Sprint win by Speightstown, trainer Pletcher and owner Melnyk were bellowing from the rafters that Speightstown should be awarded the sprint eclipse...exhorting that if you don't show up on Breeders' Cup day...you shouldn't be awarded championship honors.

It was almost funny...they both seemed to be speaking the exact same words from a prepared script. Clearly they had an agenda, but reality is they threw it all at the wall, and it stuck. Some day they may wish they didn't say what they did...but they did; and Speightstown (trained by Pletcher and owned by Pletcher) was awarded the sprint eclipse.

It all ties to what you said Dave C..."RA's connections did not do that and therefore the trophy should not go to them."

Team Rachel A took a risk, and Zenyatta delivered a performance for the ages. WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!

Your position mirrors/parallels Jerry Bailey's post Breeders' Cup Classic comments. He made no bones about it...Zenyatta was his Horse Of The Year...no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

Regardless our opinions, insights etc...the vote is still in the hands of eclipse voters. Who knows for sure what voters will do?

Taking that one step further...I agree with trainer Baffert on Zenyatta..."If they don't reward her with Horse of the Year, it would be a travesty."

Respectfully

[zinn21]

Beating the best field of older males "for fun" must be weighted much much higher than any race RA ran this year. Again in any other year RA merits HOY. But gang, Z is something very very special. She is on par with Secretariat. When everything was on the line she crushed. And she did it two minute licking the first three eighths of the race. She is hands down HOY.

[Sysonby]

Also as Affirmed would have told anyone if he were alive (and if he could speak ), sometimes all you have to beat is one and one is enough. Life is Sweet is a real horse. She not only won the Ladies Classic (golf tournament) but she was third in Hollywood Gold Cup, won the Santa Margarita, the La Canada and the El Encino this year. If it weren't for Zenyatta, she'd have a real claim for top older filly. Zenyatta made her look like a cheap horse but Life is Sweet beat everything else this year.

It's a shame that California went the way of the synthetics and it coincided with Zenyatta's career. I absolutely don't blame Jess Jackson for not wanting to run on it and I think Rachel is a remarkable filly. But I just saw a mare make a stunning move in deep stretch and run down some of the best older males in training. As anyone who watches these races out here, it is rare to watch a move like that at any level. These surfaces are deep and tiring and most horses spin their wheels. Few show real brilliance.

I was blown away and I thought Rachel had it all sewn up.

[pfrsue]

I know it isn't supposed to have any bearing on the voting at all, but I'm wondering if the fact that RA is supposed to race again next year--and therefore would have another potential shot at HOY--might garner Zenyatta more votes? The sentimental factor, as it were.