[quote="Des"]My Question Again....Did he claim them sore or did he run them in the ground to make them sore....?????[/quote]
I would say both....
jockeys mutiny against Michael Gill
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mightyhijames
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penn officials are barring gill horses pending an investigation:
http://www.drf.com/news/article/110383.html
http://www.drf.com/news/article/110383.html
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btcountess
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I think Gill is definitely a low life but no one has mentioned all the huge owners and trainers that receive top honors week after week who are ruining our industry with juicing to run them as long as possible. They run them sore and lame and those horses go virtually unnoticed as the big winners take the limelight. Sorry to be so jaded but I get tired of the good small trainers not getting the kudos they deserve and the big ones hiring attorneys to keep them winning races and awards.
Horses are pure love.
I think what is most telling in this whole fiasco, is that the jockeys, the guys that go out there and risk their lives are REFUSING to ride these horses and REFUSING to ride in races with these horses entered.
Knowing jockeys are making a living by riding mounts, they are giving up the opportunity to make money by refusing to ride. It's their lives and they are concerned. Do they know something we don't know?
I think that is the key here.
Knowing jockeys are making a living by riding mounts, they are giving up the opportunity to make money by refusing to ride. It's their lives and they are concerned. Do they know something we don't know?
I think that is the key here.
I know nothing about this chap being from across the pond. I have a few questions. Are his breakdown rates higher than other owners ? Has Mr Gill been in trouble with the law ? Why is he disliked, is it because of his model of race horse ownership ? Sure jockeys have a right to refuse to ride what ever they want but since when did they become the judge, jury and executioner ? If they have a reason for boycotting this man they should come out with it or have they already ?
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going4stamina
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He also has employed Chemical Cole Norman as his "off track stable trainer". Cole, had "miraculous" results in Southern and Southwest Regional tracks before being incarcerated for his personal chemical mistakes. I think only EPO could explain some of the things I was seeing.
UN-BEEEI--LEEE-VAAA-BLE, indeed. (channeling my best Trevor Denman here).
He and Gill have sought there own level. About the height of a snake.
UN-BEEEI--LEEE-VAAA-BLE, indeed. (channeling my best Trevor Denman here).
He and Gill have sought there own level. About the height of a snake.
About 10 years ago at Laurel Park, Gill had a horse breakdown in a race. The track wanted to do a necrospy on the horse but when they went to get the horse his leg ( the one that broke ) was missing. Mike Gill had instructed his vet to go and get it. Our vet said they were trying to hide cobra venom injected into the leg that eleviates any pain the horse feels.
This man has been doing this for years, he needs to leave the sport.
winds
This man has been doing this for years, he needs to leave the sport.
winds
Sheikh wrote:I know nothing about this chap being from across the pond. I have a few questions. Are his breakdown rates higher than other owners ? Has Mr Gill been in trouble with the law ? Why is he disliked, is it because of his model of race horse ownership ? Sure jockeys have a right to refuse to ride what ever they want but since when did they become the judge, jury and executioner ? If they have a reason for boycotting this man they should come out with it or have they already ?
The jockeys have come out with their reasons-they don't feel safe riding Gill's horses or even riding other horses in the same race with Gill's horses. One jockey was quoted as saying many jockeys won't tuck in behind a Gill horse for fear that the horse will go down and take their horse with it.
There's an article from a local paper at http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2010/01/penn_national_jockeys_refuse_t.html that explains the situation a bit more.
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mini's mom
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michael gill & banning his horses
I worked at sufolk in 2005 and was asked by tammi campbell to take a horse that she cared about - her name is famous woman
famous had a fractured right ankle & had foundered in the left front - she was unable to walk when the nerve blocks (that mike gill) had instructed his trainer to give her.
Tammi told me that if I did not take her then she would go to the killers on tuesday as Gill was liquidating his horses due to the IRS audit
I took Famous home on MOnday pm - she is doing fine - is on bar shoes & has to be shod every 5 weeks to make sure that she stays sound
I think that what the jockeys have done is a good thing and they are trying to protect themselves in a damgerous business - race riding at its best is dangerous & life in a wheelchair is not a good thing.
Gill runs to many broken down or nerve blocked horses and everyone in the industry knows it. What he did to my mare was just inhumane, unprofessional and lack of caring for another creature other than himself.
I told the Bloodhorse that they should be ashamed of itself for giving gill the leading owner award in 2005 - but they had to giv it to "someone"
He should be banned from every track for life & like Moss said - he does not give back to the indurstry and ruins his horses
minismom
famous had a fractured right ankle & had foundered in the left front - she was unable to walk when the nerve blocks (that mike gill) had instructed his trainer to give her.
Tammi told me that if I did not take her then she would go to the killers on tuesday as Gill was liquidating his horses due to the IRS audit
I took Famous home on MOnday pm - she is doing fine - is on bar shoes & has to be shod every 5 weeks to make sure that she stays sound
I think that what the jockeys have done is a good thing and they are trying to protect themselves in a damgerous business - race riding at its best is dangerous & life in a wheelchair is not a good thing.
Gill runs to many broken down or nerve blocked horses and everyone in the industry knows it. What he did to my mare was just inhumane, unprofessional and lack of caring for another creature other than himself.
I told the Bloodhorse that they should be ashamed of itself for giving gill the leading owner award in 2005 - but they had to giv it to "someone"
He should be banned from every track for life & like Moss said - he does not give back to the indurstry and ruins his horses
minismom
winds wrote:About 10 years ago at Laurel Park, Gill had a horse breakdown in a race. The track wanted to do a necrospy on the horse but when they went to get the horse his leg ( the one that broke ) was missing. Mike Gill had instructed his vet to go and get it. Our vet said they were trying to hide cobra venom injected into the leg that eleviates any pain the horse feels.
This man has been doing this for years, he needs to leave the sport.
winds
These message boards and track gossip is exactly what causes so much misinformation to be spread. The incident you are citing happened in 2003 at Gulfstream not Laurel, but anyone reading your post who doesn't know much about Gill will think that he did it twice.
The DRF article was interesting, Gill is quoted as saying that aside from the recent breakdowns (6 since October 1) he has only had 1 other breakdown at all the tracks he raced at during 2009. Of course, the lower class horses are running at Penn but as DES has repeatedly asked is Gill running the horses into the ground or are they being claimed sore. My guess is that it is 50/50.
This weekend I may do some research and see if I can put numbers together for percentages of Gill horses vs other high volume horses but I have not started so am not sure how readily available this information will be to find.
I was at Laurel at the time it happened at Gulfstream, and my vet did say it was cobra venom they were trying to hide. I apologize for getting the tracks mixed up but the incedent did happen and it was Michael Gill. It wasn't track gossip it did happen and why are you defending a man that is only out for himself without a thought about his horses?
winds
winds
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wilf
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One of Gill's cries is that none of his horses have had a positive test. Well that's a white lie as at a place like Mountaineer if you have three tests of a legal drug well OVER the limits allowed then you are suspended. Gill gets around that by having more than one trainer at the track so that when one is suspended he loses no time in transferring his stock. Of course his trainers are known to push the limits otherwise they don't last. For Pete's sake Delahoussaye broke one of his own down the other night and even got $5000 for his trouble as the poor thing was claimed. I should go and work for them to learn the tricks and find out just how to kill one as I have abused horses for years and only had one bow and one pull up with a suspensory tear. I am sure that blocking fractures is the biggest culprit and of course that is easy to do with a "voodoo" vet and an operation off the track. If overseas members were to read this thread they would be horrified!
I was at Penn and besides my horses being nags 
, I found it really easy to leave "The Michael Gill Show" (my term of affection for Penn). The track froze way too easily and was the equivalent to running on pavement at times. I never became more thankful for sound "nags" then I did there.
There is no vet check pre-race (for horses stabled there) , which at any track is absurd especially when you consider the dough PNG pulls down from the casino.
My jock even told me he would have loved to stay but he wasn't as young and crazy as he used to be, and the statement about tucking in behind Gill's horses was on the lips of many jocks. I kind of became embarassed to even have blue and white silks.
I think seahorse made mention about the horses that were "eased,faltered...ect ect...." now those descriptions seemed to come at a hell of a clip for Gill horses. Maybe someone who's more tech savvy than me can generate a report on that easier than pouring over race notes one at a time.
I am a firm believer that everything happens for a reason. And while I bemoaned the tracks inability to be anything but dreadful on some frigid nights, I think perhaps it may have helped shine a much needed light on someone who was slinking in the shadows.
, I found it really easy to leave "The Michael Gill Show" (my term of affection for Penn). The track froze way too easily and was the equivalent to running on pavement at times. I never became more thankful for sound "nags" then I did there.
There is no vet check pre-race (for horses stabled there) , which at any track is absurd especially when you consider the dough PNG pulls down from the casino.
My jock even told me he would have loved to stay but he wasn't as young and crazy as he used to be, and the statement about tucking in behind Gill's horses was on the lips of many jocks. I kind of became embarassed to even have blue and white silks.
I think seahorse made mention about the horses that were "eased,faltered...ect ect...." now those descriptions seemed to come at a hell of a clip for Gill horses. Maybe someone who's more tech savvy than me can generate a report on that easier than pouring over race notes one at a time.
I am a firm believer that everything happens for a reason. And while I bemoaned the tracks inability to be anything but dreadful on some frigid nights, I think perhaps it may have helped shine a much needed light on someone who was slinking in the shadows.
trying to come up with something brillant..... this may take a while. 
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BridledObsession
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We'll never know the answer as to how sore the horses are that Gill claims, but we do know that he usually manages to "improve" them - for a short time, at least. What becomes pertinent is what he does to keep a "sore" horse running vs. what the former owner/trainer was doing: ethical vs. non-ethical treatments.
I also have to add that the "Gill rumors" more or less snuck up on me over the last year or so. They started slowly and then gained momentum. Eventually, even if you chalk it all up to just "bad luck", the statistics started backing up the rumors. But what really hammers it home for me is the jockey's stand on this issue. PENN is like a small village. Everyone knows everyone and many people have been around forever. The jockeys have their racing experiences to go on (and they are the ones who know the true stats - not just the limited info reported in the charts) and all the information from their multiple friends/relatives that are employed in every capacity on the backside. I believe that they made an informed decision Saturday night. I also believe that, being the very competitive, diverse, and sometimes combative group that they are, they would not stand together in denying themselves money if they did not wholeheartedly believe their lives were at stake.
I also have to add that the "Gill rumors" more or less snuck up on me over the last year or so. They started slowly and then gained momentum. Eventually, even if you chalk it all up to just "bad luck", the statistics started backing up the rumors. But what really hammers it home for me is the jockey's stand on this issue. PENN is like a small village. Everyone knows everyone and many people have been around forever. The jockeys have their racing experiences to go on (and they are the ones who know the true stats - not just the limited info reported in the charts) and all the information from their multiple friends/relatives that are employed in every capacity on the backside. I believe that they made an informed decision Saturday night. I also believe that, being the very competitive, diverse, and sometimes combative group that they are, they would not stand together in denying themselves money if they did not wholeheartedly believe their lives were at stake.
IcouldbeU wrote:winds wrote:About 10 years ago at Laurel Park, Gill had a horse breakdown in a race. The track wanted to do a necrospy on the horse but when they went to get the horse his leg ( the one that broke ) was missing. Mike Gill had instructed his vet to go and get it. Our vet said they were trying to hide cobra venom injected into the leg that eleviates any pain the horse feels.
This man has been doing this for years, he needs to leave the sport.
winds
These message boards and track gossip is exactly what causes so much misinformation to be spread. The incident you are citing happened in 2003 at Gulfstream not Laurel, but anyone reading your post who doesn't know much about Gill will think that he did it twice.
The DRF article was interesting, Gill is quoted as saying that aside from the recent breakdowns (6 since October 1) he has only had 1 other breakdown at all the tracks he raced at during 2009. Of course, the lower class horses are running at Penn but as DES has repeatedly asked is Gill running the horses into the ground or are they being claimed sore. My guess is that it is 50/50.
This weekend I may do some research and see if I can put numbers together for percentages of Gill horses vs other high volume horses but I have not started so am not sure how readily available this information will be to find.
There's a very long thread at http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum//showthread.php?t=231681&referrerid=0 that starts off with a list of Gill owned horses that have either broken down or been eased at Penn National since last October (8 broke down, 1 returned lame, 6 eased). Then, about page 8 they start talking about the current situation with the jockeys. It's a place to start your research.