Trainers and Breakdowns

xfactor fan · Postby **xfactor fan** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:31 am

The intent of this thread is not to start wholesale trainer bashing. But to take a look at training styles and how training contributes to breakdowns.

For example two top trainers Lucas and Baffert started in Quarter Horses. Michael Matz in eventing ( which has to be the understatement of the century) Graham Motion is a classic British trainer, John Shirreffs in Appaloosas.

How do the horses fare under each trainer, how does the injury rate compare, what kind of horses do well with each training style.

And lets all concentrate on training, and keep the "Stallion of Doom" out of the discussion.

Bast · Postby **Bast** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:37 am

I would also like to look at the methods of past trainers acknowledged as masters, but I'm not sure how we could do that.

LB · Postby LB » Thu May 26, 2011 12:13 pm

Michael Matz competed in show jumping, not eventing. Maryland trainer Rodney Jenkins was also a very successful jumper rider.

DDT · Postby **DDT** » Thu May 26, 2011 2:02 pm

I believe Tim Ritchey also has a show/jumping background.

DDT

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Thu May 26, 2011 2:33 pm

LB wrote:Michael Matz competed in show jumping, not eventing.....

Right! I was just posting that exact thing!

Show jumping and eventing are entirely different and I daresay jumpers and eventers are trained and conditioned differently also.

Sailor Kenshin · Postby **Sailor Kenshin** » Thu May 26, 2011 3:01 pm

Was it common in the past for horse trainer to 'jump' from Quarters to Thoroughbreds? Or even show jumping?

And if not, why now?

kimberley mine · Postby **kimberley mine** » Thu May 26, 2011 4:41 pm

Gai Waterhouse, super Aussie trainer, is the daughter of Tommy "TJ" Smith, super trainer.

Before training horses on her own, she acted in Doctor Who.

louis finochio · Postby **louis finochio** » Thu May 26, 2011 7:30 pm

Trainers must have the patience of Job. I have seen & become friends with all those HOF trainers of the past, that have passed on.

Trainers must come up the ranks, bottom up, before they go out on their own. Jim Buss, trainer didnt come up under any good trainer, he went on his own before paying his dues.

Jim Buss would ask me my opinion of the tb he purchased at the sales. I told him they were a nice lot. But they were not, JB didnt have any knoledge of pedigrees. His father who owns the LA Lakers, pulled the plug on his son's owner & trainer fiasco & quit the business.

A novice owner must select a trainer with experience, that wins many races. Ask around the yards what trainers are the best to train your tb.

valjoe · Postby **valjoe** » Thu May 26, 2011 9:38 pm

I told him they were a nice lot. But they were not,

wow Luis, how nice of you. I guess we shouldn't believe a word you say..

DDT · Postby **DDT** » Thu May 26, 2011 11:59 pm

I guess that tells us what kind of man Louis Finochio really is, one not to be trusted.

DDT

xfactor fan · Postby **xfactor fan** » Fri May 27, 2011 12:58 am

Oops Sorry about the mistake about Michael Matz. I knew he rode jumpers. So did Rodney Jenkins.

Well Louis started trainer bashing, which has no place here. At least he didn't drag in the stallion of doom in his first post.

Matz married into the King Ranch extended family. Don't know if he had any interest in racing TB's before.

Would jumpers be more like QH's? Quick bursts of extreme effort, not long sustained efforts?

Bast · Postby **Bast** » Fri May 27, 2011 2:16 am

louis finochio wrote:Trainers must come up the ranks, bottom up, before they go out on their own. Jim Buss, trainer didnt come up under any good trainer, he went on his own before paying his dues.

Jim Buss would ask me my opinion of the tb he purchased at the sales. I told him they were a nice lot. But they were not, JB didnt have any knoledge of pedigrees. His father who owns the LA Lakers, pulled the plug on his son's owner & trainer fiasco & quit the business.

So, what was your motivation in giving Buss misleading, inaccurate information?

This strikes me as dishonest.

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Fri May 27, 2011 5:58 am

Jumpers need agility, responsiveness and ability to judge the obstacles. They need to shorten or lengthen a stride here and there to set up for the leap. It's nothing whatsoever like race training for either QH or TB.

I know Matz RODE jumpers, I don't know if he trained them. Most of the big name jump riders have their "team" - there is a coach, a trainer, etc. The horse is trained, the rider is taught, and then they are coached as a team.

Sailor Kenshin · Postby **Sailor Kenshin** » Fri May 27, 2011 6:05 am

I would be interested to know if there is such a thing as QH racing strategy.

From the few I've watched, it seems it's just an all-out blast to the finish; the jocks break from the gate really busy and no one tries for a rail position.

madelyn · Postby **madelyn** » Fri May 27, 2011 6:14 am

Sailor Kenshin wrote:I would be interested to know if there is such a thing as QH racing strategy.

From the few I've watched, it seems it's just an all-out blast to the finish; the jocks break from the gate really busy and no one tries for a rail position.

I rode racing qh's back in the late 60's/early 70's, when I could eat what I wanted and still weigh 105 lbs soaking wet. It was all about the break and keeping the horse as straight as possible. Position mattered - center of the rider's weight forward on the withers. And staying on.