Melbourne Cup

Joltman · Postby **Joltman** » Tue Nov 05, 2013 7:15 am

If there was any doubt til now, just read the results of the BC Classic and Melbourne Cup.

http://www.news.com.au/sport/superracin ... 6753549090

Would be great to see this one some time.

jm

wilf · Postby **wilf** » Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:52 pm

It's cheaper now to fly to Australia than it was 20 years ago. Bucket list stuff for any racing fan, you will not be disappointed. The Melbourne Cup is always on the second tuesday in November and it is the second day of the Carnival. Day one is the saturday which is the better racing day actually, featuring the Derby. Day three is the thursday and is Oaks Day and day four is the saturday ,again all stakes races of the highest calibre unless you get stuck meeting new friends in the car park for some elite champagne-style tailgating.

erins isle · Postby **erins isle** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:03 am

Great to see this, and the winner is by that incredible sire the late Monsun from Germany.

Joltman · Postby **Joltman** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:08 am

Why can't we get more of those bloodlines in the USA?

jm

Shergar · Postby **Shergar** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:05 pm

Joltman wrote:Why can't we get more of those bloodlines in the USA?

jm

Until there is an emphasis on 10f plus races, (especially turf) nobody in the US will ever want to breed to a sire that is long winded.

And some folks, (who will remain nameless) think the BC marathon should get the axe.

Shergar

kimberley mine · Postby **kimberley mine** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:17 pm

Check this out....like mother, like daughter.

Here's Fiorente's second dam, Desert Beauty:

http://www.pedigreequery.com/desert+beauty

And his third dam, Hellenic:

http://www.pedigreequery.com/hellenic3

That apple did NOT fall far from the tree.

Regarding gettng horses with the bloodlines to run 2 miles, when there are enough 2 mile races carded to make it economical to breed and race them, there will be quality US-bred horses who run 2 miles. If there are no opportunities to make money at the claiming and allowance levels, which is where the vast majority of horses run, then to even try is to shoot for the moon. A breed-to-race owner can't afford that. The big syndicates trying to make their stallions won't even try.

Mac · Postby **Mac** » Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:01 pm

I love route races. Just love watching them. My partner and I have a few mares and we are trying to breed for two-turns. Don't get me wrong, if we had a nice sprinter that we had bred or purchased to race, I'd love and be so proud of that horse. But the two turn races seem so much more fun to watch for whatever reason. And I think the Melbourne Cup is a great addition to a bucket list.

Patuxet · Postby **Patuxet** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 9:07 am

Until 1975 the Jockey Club Gold Cup was contested at two miles. It attracted 3YO classic horses and their truly tested elders. As often as not it helped determined the HOY title. These storied horses won it as 3YOs and were named HOY: Arts And Letters. Damascus, Buckpasser, Nashua, Hill Prince and Citation.

In 1976 a half mile was chopped off the distance; in 1990 it was shortened by another quarter mile. What was designed as a true test of American distance and stamina ability was reduced to supporting cast status for the money ladened BC Classic. Why? Permissive drug policies? Trainers from quarterhorse backgrounds instead of steeplechase? All the usual suspects.

From my perspective the once great and noble Jockey Club Gold Cup -- along with the once classic-testing CCA Oaks -- now stand as sad symbols of our steadily diminishing sport.

Shergar · Postby **Shergar** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 3:32 pm

You look at the list of JCGC winners and it is a who's who of Hall of Fame horses.

I'm going to look up how much weight Kelso carried in his five JCGC wins.

According to Wikipedia, "FWIW" Kelso carried 130 or more on 24 occasions.

Can you imagine if one of todays handicap horses was asked to carry 130 lbs? I'm sure their connections would have a fit.

Shergar

ratherrapid · Postby **ratherrapid** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:49 pm

Women Trainers win Melbourne Cup and BC Classic--in the same week! Criquette Head wins Arc. :shock:

wallinga · Postby **wallinga** » Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:54 pm

kimberley mine wrote:Check this out....like mother, like daughter.

Here's Fiorente's second dam, Desert Beauty:

http://www.pedigreequery.com/desert+beauty

And his third dam, Hellenic:

http://www.pedigreequery.com/hellenic3

That apple did NOT fall far from the tree.

Regarding gettng horses with the bloodlines to run 2 miles, when there are enough 2 mile races carded to make it economical to breed and race them, there will be quality US-bred horses who run 2 miles. If there are no opportunities to make money at the claiming and allowance levels, which is where the vast majority of horses run, then to even try is to shoot for the moon. A breed-to-race owner can't afford that. The big syndicates trying to make their stallions won't even try.

They are photos of the same horse aren't they?

erins isle · Postby **erins isle** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:42 am

No they just look a lot like one another. Look at the heads the hair is different.

kimberley mine · Postby **kimberley mine** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 1:30 pm

wallinga wrote:
They are photos of the same horse aren't they?

No, they're two different horses, but the daughter looks so much like the dam it's amazing. Look at Desert Beauty's topline....the top of her butt is higher than her wither. Hellenic's withers are higher than her rump and really shark-fin pointy.

Out of curiosity I'd like to see a conformation shot of Fiorente next to his granddam and great granddam.

erins isle · Postby **erins isle** » Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:03 am

http://www.ballymacollstud.com/history.cfm

The home of Fiorente and also Derby winner Troy.

A very interesting site about a very old stud.

wallinga · Postby **wallinga** » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:23 pm

kimberley mine wrote:
wallinga wrote:
They are photos of the same horse aren't they?

No, they're two different horses, but the daughter looks so much like the dam it's amazing. Look at Desert Beauty's topline....the top of her butt is higher than her wither. Hellenic's withers are higher than her rump and really shark-fin pointy.

Out of curiosity I'd like to see a conformation shot of Fiorente next to his granddam and great granddam.

Wow that is scarey similar