tough horses

[sprucie]

I went to look at Personal Flag for a mare of mine, but when I was told that they wouldn't even take him out of his paddock, I quickly changed my mind. Another really tough stallion I saw that day was Signal Tap. He was downright nasty, and charged the front of his stall at us several times. They wouldn't take him out of the stall either.

[Gem]

I'm proud to say that though the other stallion on our yard(not mine) is pretty tempermental ,likes to lunge at you, mine is reularly handled by children, under supervision, can be ridden in company, and is turned out with others! Not all stallions are monsters!

[marg]

To LSB;I read your post re Carson City-----so I had to do some digging to find some info re our trip to stud farms.The trip was in 1994 and the horse was Carson City.Corporate Report was in the paddock nearest to Carson City----he was a favourite of the grooms.It was Carson City that they would not bring out-----with the ring etc.I asked my husband if he could remember which horse it had been and he said right away that it was Carson City.He had always liked him better than I did.Maybe the horse mellowed as the years went on.I do not know but I know it was Carson City-------unless the grooms didn't know what they were saying.
As far as the horse being pretty-----he was full of himself----looked pretty to me-----I guess beauty is all in the eye of the beholder!Marg.

[summerhorse]

Well all stallions have the potential to be nasty with all that testosterone flowing and the frustration of being locked up away from mares and within sight (but not reach) of the other stallions. Remember that TBs are specifically bred for fighting spirit, well that comes out in ALL facets of life, not just racing unfortunately. Then the habit of most farms of letting them run wild as babies and then "breaking" them (versus training them) and then sometimes the questionable handling they might face if they end up sold a lot or just have a high turnover of grooms/handlers. Not everyone on the track or farm is kind or good with horses. So besides coming by it naturally I would bet a lot is in the handling and "keeping" of TB stallions. But some are just looney. The difference is that in other breeds they just aren't worth enough to keep around if they are dangerous but Dynaformer is worth what $100,000 a shot or so next year, they WILL be keeping him if they have to build a chute system for him.

At Airdrie none of them were impossible for the guys to handle but several J.R. said would take off your hand given the opportunity including Silver Hawk who was supposed to be the worst of all! also Stormin' Fever, Siphon, Forest Camp... but none of them acted the least bit aggressive and we got to pet them all so... I guess they just have bad days! And they just went in the stalls with a lead rope and led them out to the paddocks without a problem.

Alydar was always a bad one and he passed it on. The stallion Aly T mentioned aboved (a good example of a horse that shouldn't even have BEEN a stallion but anyway...) was never overly aggressive until he snapped (he was tough but no tougher than any other stallion) and tried to kill his owner. He grabbed her by the arm and was twirling her around his head (imagine the power these animals have?!!!) Then he dropped her and was doing the knee thing biting her even while people were beating on him and throwing stuff at him and she was trying to get away. Then the other stallion there, one she had raised from a foal jumped his fence (i think it was 6'!) and attacked Aly T driving him away from her and down the road and finally into a field where he stood guard at the "gate". It took him awhile to calm down enough for anyone to get near him to catch him. But no way was he letting Aly T out of there! I imagine that horse has a home for life!

I think once they all calmed down both stallions were fine (temper wise). They put down Aly T to have him tested for rabies but he was fine, just went beserk.

In Tissar (I think his name was, stood at Monty Robert's farm) was a vicious nutcase. He was always tough but then proceeded to try and kill mares and then people. They rigged up a chute system so nobody had to ever touch him and he could breed the mare without actually being able to touch any of the rest of her. I guess he must have got some good runners because frankly pedigree or not I'd have shot the SOB the first time he tried to kill the mare and the grooms (same time!). But of course he was owned by someone else, just stood at the farm. I guess they figured somebody else wouldn't be able to handle him or might really abuse him and somebody would get killed so they would just keep him since they COULD handle him. I don't know. I don't think psychopaths should breed on. But then I've not heard that he passed that evilness on either but I am not up on CA area runners.

It is funny because I've heard that a couple times that Foolish Pleasure was a bad ass but once he left KY I haven't heard ANYthing that would suggest he was very mean. Of course maybe that is why they sold him from CA but the guy who bought him in WY never said he was mean and they tried very hard to save him when he got colic. Of course they also let him live naturally turned out in a big pasture with 10 mares so that might have eased a lot of his frustration! I never heard that he was anything but nice to work with on the track. It does kind of make you wonder sometimes if something (or someone) sets off some of these attitudes. And horses NEVEr forget...

[anemone]

I asked about Spectacular Tide in another thread. He is from what i heard the opposite to these monsters you describe. Where did he get that? He is gentle, easy to handle, always nice to people. He raced in USA and has been kept at stud in Sweden as any other stallion. Even if i agree, stallions have a frustrating life, how come this S T is such a nice and quiet horse? Some must be genes. Please, take a look at his pedigree and tell me, where does his nice temper come from?

[Roguelet]

Alydar was always a bad one and he passed it on. The stallion Aly T mentioned aboved (a good example of a horse that shouldn't even have BEEN a stallion but anyway...) was never overly aggressive until he snapped (he was tough but no tougher than any other stallion) and tried to kill his owner. He grabbed her by the arm and was twirling her around his head (imagine the power these animals have?!!!) Then he dropped her and was doing the knee thing biting her even while people were beating on him and throwing stuff at him and she was trying to get away. Then the other stallion there, one she had raised from a foal jumped his fence (i think it was 6'!) and attacked Aly T driving him away from her and down the road and finally into a field where he stood guard at the "gate". It took him awhile to calm down enough for anyone to get near him to catch him. But no way was he letting Aly T out of there! I imagine that horse has a home for life!

I think once they all calmed down both stallions were fine (temper wise). They put down Aly T to have him tested for rabies but he was fine, just went beserk.

I'm curious... where did you get your information? Your version of what happened has a lot more"hollywood details" than my version.

[sarahcook]

While they were racing(its late and I've had wine..so its short for now):
Cornado's Quest-missed alot bigger races because he couldn't handle certain paddocks, refused to do this and that..offspring are the same.
Holy Bull-offspring are the same as him.
Dynaformer-nuts

[ZiaLand]

Then the other stallion there, one she had raised from a foal jumped his fence (i think it was 6'!) and attacked Aly T driving him away from her and down the road and finally into a field where he stood guard at the "gate". It took him awhile to calm down enough for anyone to get near him to catch him. But no way was he letting Aly T out of there! I imagine that horse has a home for life!

quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the "good stallion" in this incident Daufauskie Pirate (sp?). I heard this story some time ago and it really stuck with me.

Laurie

[Nessa]

Then the other stallion there, one she had raised from a foal jumped his fence (i think it was 6'!) and attacked Aly T driving him away from her and down the road and finally into a field where he stood guard at the "gate". It took him awhile to calm down enough for anyone to get near him to catch him. But no way was he letting Aly T out of there! I imagine that horse has a home for life!

quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the "good stallion" in this incident Daufauskie Pirate (sp?). I heard this story some time ago and it really stuck with me.

Laurie

It's Daufuskie Pirate.

[Deartoall81]

Isn't Dynaformer supposed to be tough to handle? Gentlemen looked like a nightmare when I saw him last year. Alleged had issues too.

Dynaformer supposedly DOES have an evil temper. Someone had posted a photo taken of him on an MSN horse racing board, and his eyes...his eyes....

From quotes in the Blood Horse: Almahmoud was said not to have "much use for humans", and Menetrier WAS indeed followed by a man with a shotgun!

OTOH: Seattle Slew, who showed so much fire on the track, turned out to be "the gentlest of stallions.

[Deartoall81]

I believe that War Relic by Man O' War has been described as viscious.

War Admiral's battles with the assistant starters are well known, on occasion, he would start outside the gate! At stud, the sight of another stallion would set him off, and he would attempt to climb the tree in his paddock. (Refence: The Kentucky Derby, by Peter Chew)

I sometimes wonder if the nasty stallions spoken of are this way because they are confined to their stalls? A chapter in Sire Lines, by Abram S. Hewitt (btw: due to be reprinted 11/2006!) mentions a stallion named McGee (sire of Exterminator); who was said to be vicious when he entered stud.
But after the horse was sold at a dispersal auction when the owner died, it was found his bad temper resulted from being confined in close quarters. Once given a bit more freedom to move, he apparently mellowed out.

[kimberley mine]

In the book $tud, the author visited Woodman a week after he bit off a groom's thumb.

[austique]

I was at Walmac last year and it was raining and all the other stallions had been brought in except Gentlemen and they said they couldn't catch him unless it was time to eat or time to breed

[Intrinsic Worth]

Catrail was vicious as hell in Ireland and when he was sold to Wafare farm, all I could think of is that they've better got some good stallion handlers. I was supposed to fly with him to the US, but decided against it.

Ridgewood Ben, full brother to Ridgewood Pearl, was also very mean. I think he's gelded now as he was a failure at stud.

Changeintheweather is mean and always has been. When they retired him and were breeding him to test mares, he attacked a mare and kicked an artery and she nearly bled to death. I think he got the meanness from his dam, she was temperamental and had some mean foals before she died.

The dam of Rock and Roll, Secret's Halo (by Halo), was mean as hell. She ripped a groom's ear off once. Pin Oak actually bred her to Storm Cat and we were all expecting a demon to pop out, but he actually turned out to be a sweet horse.

[summerhorse]

There was a long story about Aly T's attack in the Thoroughbred Times. A full page (and that page is big! )

I think I saved it, don't know if they would have it on their site or not.

And I do imagine a lot of these horses would be less "mean" if allowed to live naturally or at least turned out most of the time. There are a couple of farms who keep them inside ALL the time, talk about creating a frustrated stallion, just hand grazing ISN'T going to be enough for a horse, they need to run and roll and play.