Elusive Quality - where are his Derby aspirants?

[Flight]

We have had the pleasure (?) of having this horse stand down here for the past three seasons and he has been priced at the higher end of the scale however, I just have to wonder why he does not have a Derby contender this year?

Have some gone amiss or did he not have any to begin with? In fact, does he have any topliners in the three year old ranks?

Some of his yearlings have sold quite well yet I'm not convinced that he is totally suited to our conditions. I don't often see Hero's Honour in a pedigree. What is his claim to fame?

Time will tell but for $110k a pop, I can get three maybe four service fees to proven local stallions.

[Heidilady]

Well he sired 2004's Kentucky Derby winner. None appeared this year but that doesn't mean he's worthless. He probably picked up some better mares from Smarty's preps in 2004 but his real pickup in mare quality (however much of one there was--I haven't seen his book from that year) won't be felt in 3yo Derby contenders til 2009. Remember his 2005 breeding season had the post-Smarty pickup with those foals born this year. Some, I'm sure, are still yet to be born and some of the mares that might've been sent to the more proven Elusive Quality got sent to Smarty for the standard uber-high first year flashy sire fee.

Look at his 2008 2yo crop to see what effect siring a Derby winner had on Derby hopefuls of the future. If patience is not a virtue, check out the 2007 yearlings. 2009 would be a fairer year to judge him though, not 2006. He has been fairly useful in other ways though besides the Derby.

You could probably do other things with the money, sure, but I suppose it would depend on how well his offspring sell in an Aussie auction environment. I'd breed to Elusive Quality before I hit up Giant's Causeway myself.

[bcassidy]

Flight....I have a privately devised system which evaluates stallions on their ability to improve the mares he covers and EQ scores very high in my system. Right up there with Distorted Humor. I think that EQ and Distorted Humor will be the two super stallions in the very near future. Don't know why that wouldn't be true for his southern hemisphere offspring as well---because EQ throws very talented turf runners as well.

[louis finochio]

My favorite filly Elusive Diva, by EQ has retired and is being bred this spring in Ky.

ED was a super filly and I wish her all the best in the breeding shed.

[HR LLC]

Flight,

There are a lot of top sires like Storm Cat, AP Indy, Seeking the Gold, Unbridled's Song etc that dont have any KY Derby winners.

Not sure what the issue is with EQ's 3YO this year.

He has 85 registred 3YO's in 2006 and I thought Elusive Star would be his best chance but that horse can't break its maiden. Black Watch was another top selling 2YO back in 2005 and that horse is still a maiden. Elusiveness was another top selling 2YO in 2005 but that horse is racing in Japan.

One good thing for EQ is the fact that he has 111 registred 2YOs in 2006.

[Elusive City]

We have had the pleasure (?) of having this horse stand down here for the past three seasons and he has been priced at the higher end of the scale however, I just have to wonder why he does not have a Derby contender this year?

Have some gone amiss or did he not have any to begin with? In fact, does he have any topliners in the three year old ranks?

Some of his yearlings have sold quite well yet I'm not convinced that he is totally suited to our conditions. I don't often see Hero's Honour in a pedigree. What is his claim to fame?

Time will tell but for $110k a pop, I can get three maybe four service fees to proven local stallions.

Proven stallions? **LOL** Ever hear of Smarty Jones. And I guess thats why Godolphin sent ALL their good mares to him in 2005. If you saw his 2006 crop (which will truly amaze).

How bout his assertive lass Yearling colt 1.4 million? (profit 1.3 large)

I have Elusive Quality's progeny (the good and the bad) all entered so go into the database: so take a look at all of his progeny and you will be amazed.

Best 3 year old colt is Exclusive Quality a stakes winning colt with some nice speed (track record holder at gulfstream at 7F).

Elusive Quality is among the top 20 sires in the world.

Allan

PS--he'll be the leading 2 year old sire in Australia next season I gaurantee it.

[FOS]

hi Elusive City

Proven stallions? **LOL** Ever hear of Smarty Jones. And I guess thats why Godolphin sent ALL their good mares to (Elusive Quality) in 2005.

Maybe a bit of a stretch.

Yes the Dubai-boys planned on sending many of their VERY good mares to EQ in 2005, but they also had quite a few going to Kingmambo.

When Kingmambo had his problem(s) and was shut down last year, many if not all of the Darley/Godolphin mares that were originally scheduled to visit Kingmambo were redirected to Elusive Quality.

As a result, EQ's 2006 crop might fall into the exceptional category.

Best to you.

Respectfully

[madelyn]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Regarding Elusive Quality, Smarty Jones did, indeed, win the KY Derby and Preakness, and was a 3yo Eclipse champion.

But you would have to look quite hard to find a better quality mare than I'll Get Along.

In calling yourself Elusive City, I venture to guess you have a sincere interest in this particular stallion.

However, Elusive Quality stands here for $100K US, quite a jump from when he attracted the owners of I'll Get Along. What does that equate to in terms of Down Under Dollars?

The next item, though, is Flight's assertion that for that amount one could get three or four seasons to proven LOCAL stallions. Meaning stallions that are proven producers with the particular gene pool of mares available in his neck of the woods.

Don't get me wrong, a Derby winner is great for a NA stallion. Probably as good as a Melbourne Cup winner would be for a stallion in AUS/NZ.

[Shammy Davis]

BJ hinted at this on another racing thread. Tired Sperm. In the case of EQ winging it down under to Australia and subsequent trips back to NA, maybe it is "Jet Lag" sperm.

[Heidilady]

Don't get me wrong, a Derby winner is great for a NA stallion. Probably as good as a Melbourne Cup winner would be for a stallion in AUS/NZ.

Ah ha! Is Ken Ramsey trying to send Catienus to Australia? Cuz that could totally explain why he's putting Nolan's Cat through the paces for the Melbourne Cup. Sorry if that was random but I didn't know if it was an epiphany or a sign of ADD.

As far as the mares being redirected from Kingmambo, it might not be a reflection on Elusive Quality that he didn't get all of them. It could be that the mares weren't for whatever reason, as good a fit. I seriously doubt their best mares are perfect in every way AND a good pedigree/conformation fit for Elusive Quality. Some probably were and got redirected, others they figured matched up better elsewhere I suspect.

[madelyn]

[quote="HeidiladyAh ha! Is Ken Ramsey trying to send Catienus to Australia? Cuz that could totally explain why he's putting Nolan's Cat through the paces for the Melbourne Cup.[/quote]

Funny, I had just written my little bit, when I read about Nolan's Cat and had the nearly identical thought. Catienus isn't doing all that well here, especially considering the plentiful mares the Ramseys sent his way.

[Flight]

Thanks for everyones input however, I am getting more uncomfortable about EQ as we go along.

I did not mean to "pick on him" in my initial post but all I can gather is that he is the dad of Smarty Jones and not much else. Yet they expect Australian breeders to fork out $100k for a service and his median was about $200k at the Easter Sales.

I always thought that a stallion's fee would increase in line with the performance of his progeny. Does he have anything else near as good as Smarty? No? Why is he so expensive and why do some think that he is good value?

All I can say is go Dynaformer! He earnt his status.

[LSB]

Thanks for everyones input however, I am getting more uncomfortable about EQ as we go along.

The easiest way to cure your discomfort is not to breed to him.

I would have to agree that Elusive Quality is pretty agressively priced. On the other hand, I've seen a number of his offspring--including my own two year old--and I really like what I see.

Would I pay 100K to breed to him? Probably not. Am I glad I own one? Definitely yes.

[Elusive City]

[quote="Flight"]Thanks for everyones input however, I am getting more uncomfortable about EQ as we go along.

I did not mean to "pick on him" in my initial post but all I can gather is that he is the dad of Smarty Jones and not much else. Yet they expect Australian breeders to fork out $100k for a service and his median was about $200k at the Easter Sales.

I always thought that a stallion's fee would increase in line with the performance of his progeny. Does he have anything else near as good as Smarty? No? Why is he so expensive and why do some think that he is good value?

All I can say is go Dynaformer! He earnt his status.

[/quote]

Yeah Dynaformer is 21 YO, Quality 14YO. Slight difference wouldn't you say.

YOu are wrong in you estimatation of Elusive Quality. He sires fast and durable hosses.

YOu'll see this year with his 2 year olds in Australia. he'll be the leading 2YO sire there.

Elusive City

[louis finochio]

EQ is in a class all by himself at sprint distances. The key to breed a classic individual is to breed a mare to EQ with a stamina oriented pedigree.

When you combine matings of speed and stamina, a breeder will find gold at the end of the rainbow.